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Pet Forum / Aquaria / Cichlids / March 2007Top Fin Decorations
I reported problems earlier with my fish (local, freshwater, wild fish) flashing against various surfaces even though the water parameters appear okay. At that time, I also pointed out that the problem seems noticeably worse after cleaning the tank, which consists of vacuuming the gravel and replacing the water removed. Now, I'm noticing that when I clean the tank and temporarily pull out the decorations that they really smell. They smell like a mix between the black mud you find in ponds, and gasoline. I've got three large decorations in a 125 gallon tank and they all seem to smell about the same. It could simply be that waste was trapped under or within these decorations. But I can't help but wonder if there was some chemical reaction that was helping to irritate my fish. I realize Top Fin is a cheap brand, but they sell this stuff by the truckload and I would certainly have expected that they were safe for fish. Anyone have any thoughts on this? Jonathan Jonathan Wood wrote in message ... >I reported problems earlier with my fish (local, freshwater, wild fish) >flashing against various surfaces even though the water parameters appear [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > >Jonathan interested to hear if your fish are still flashing? Paul, > interested to hear if your fish are still flashing? Well, I've been busy and haven't done anything to the tank for a while--I even allowed the water level to fall a couple of inches. For the most part, the fish have been looking a bit better with one notable exception (a green sunfish that mostly scrapes the same location but shows no sign of parasites), which has now been released back to the wild. However, yesterday, I vacuumed the gravel again and top the water level off. Although it's not too bad, my large mouth bass are definitely looking a bit more irritated than normal. Jonathan || I reported problems earlier with my fish (local, freshwater, wild || fish) flashing against various surfaces even though the water [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] || || Jonathan Well... that does kinda sound weird... but my experience with plastic plants, didn't last long... as i only used them to transition to real plants.. I'd stop using them, period... just don't put them back...see what happens in a couple weeks...  SignatureRedForeman ©® future fabricator and creator of a ratbike streetfighter!!! ========================== 2003 TRX450ES 1992 TRX-350 XX (For Sale) '98 Tacoma Ext Cab 4X4 Lifted.... ========================== ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø is that better?? RedForeman, > Well... that does kinda sound weird... but my experience with plastic > plants, didn't last long... as i only used them to transition to real > plants.. Actually, it isn't the plants that smell. It's larger decorations, designed to look like pieces of wood, that smell strange. Surely this has come up before if there is a problem. I'll try searching the web. Jonathan > RedForeman, > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Jonathan I have no comments or experience with the particular product that you have, but since these products are not required to be tested against any mandatory safety specifications, manufacturers will (and do) try out different suppliers. These suppliers will experiment with different recipes for the substances used to colour and seal the product (ideally searching for a single application, colour and sealer). Don't make too many assumptions. If they had a bad recipe (or just made an error in preparing a batch), or the product was improperly prepared/primed, then the amount of bad product might not be enough to register much of a reaction to read about on the web. In any investigation, remove all variables and then replace them one by one. It might be interesting to put the artificial wood in a pail with some minnows for a few weeks. Good luck. Signaturewww.NetMax.tk NetMax, > I have no comments or experience with the particular product that you > have, but since these products are not required to be tested against any [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > the amount of bad product might not be enough to register much of a > reaction to read about on the web. Yeah, I couldn't find anything. The only assumption I'm really making is that they are selling these by the boatload and if there is a problem, I'd expect them to find out pretty quick. > In any investigation, remove all variables and then replace them one by > one. It might be interesting to put the artificial wood in a pail with > some minnows for a few weeks. Good luck. I'm definitely thinking about pulling all of them out during my next water change. Unfortunately, the tank will look pretty bare. Also, the problem is pretty subtle and it would be hard to determine when it had in fact gone away. Particularly since I would probably not do a 100% water change at that time and chemicals could possibly still be in the water. I guess I'm curious if other folks' artificial decorations (non-plants) tend to smell strange. I don't know if that's normal or not. Thanks. Jonathan > NetMax, > [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > > Jonathan And what do you think that they would do if they found out? Their reps would tell the stores to refund or replace the product if anyone comes in with a complain. What else would they do? It might have been a batch problem, so the quantity affected might be very limited (if it's even the artificial wood and not something else). Signaturewww.NetMax.tk I have 3 large artifical stumps that when i bought them they were a greenish color and in less than a year they are almost white. most of the paint has fallen off. I have never had a problem with my water or the way it looks, i know it makes no senes to me either. I no longer use them because of the way it looks now. But they did not stink that i can remember. > > NetMax, > > [quoted text clipped - 48 lines] > problem, so the quantity affected might be very limited (if it's even the > artificial wood and not something else). NetMax, > And what do you think that they would do if they found out? Their reps > would tell the stores to refund or replace the product if anyone comes in > with a complain. What else would they do? It might have been a batch > problem, so the quantity affected might be very limited (if it's even the > artificial wood and not something else). Well, the smell comes from a couple of different pieces so I can rule out a bad batch. If they made a few and a few were returned, I don't think anything would come of it. But if they were sold by the boatload, which Top Fin products are, and there was a problem, I would think they would rush to find a way to stop the lost revenues. Even a small percent of complaints from a large enough market would be a substantial amount of lost income. At any rate, although no one's said anything about, I'll just assume no one else is seeing these types of problems and it's just me. Jonathan > NetMax, > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > find a way to stop the lost revenues. Even a small percent of complaints > from a large enough market would be a substantial amount of lost income. I think you over-estimate the effect of a single product. These manufacturers could lose 100% of a product line of decorations for months, and it would not affect them. With manufacturing, at any given moment, there is always something wrong with something, it's just not advertized. Deal with the returns as they come in, in a manner which leaves the customer happy. Note that a batch problem can be in the coating, so it would affect a number of different decorations which were all processed at the same facility. > At any rate, although no one's said anything about, I'll just assume no one > else is seeing these types of problems and it's just me. Again, just my humble opinion, but the % of hobbyists who have this decoration X the number who remember they got it from Topfin X the number who got the coating batch (an assumption) X the number who noticed the problem X the number who have computers X the number who read and post in the newsgroups or forums might add up to a small number. We sometimes think we are part of a huge community, but it's actually much smaller than we think. Compared to the general public, this small community is very well educated and more likely to research the root cause. Others would take the decoration out, smell it and throw it away (end of story ;~) I'm not trying to be argumentative, just presenting a different perspective. Signaturewww.NetMax.tk > Jonathan NetMax, > I think you over-estimate the effect of a single product. These > manufacturers could lose 100% of a product line of decorations for > months, and it would not affect them. Well, I'm not trying to argue the point but, being somewhat of a business person myself, I view this it a little differently. They have an obligation to their shareholders if there is something they can do to fix a product that is resulting in many returns. > Note that a batch problem can be in the coating, so it would affect a > number of different decorations which were all processed at the same > facility. A batch suggests a number of items that were also processed within the same period of time. That would not apply in my case. > Again, just my humble opinion, but the % of hobbyists who have this > decoration X the number who remember they got it from Topfin X the number [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > would take the decoration out, smell it and throw it away (end of story > ;~) Maybe. I will try some tests with my next water change. It sure would suck to have this large 125 gallon tank with nothing but plant decorations. Thanks. Jonathan > Maybe. I will try some tests with my next water change. It sure would suck > to have this large 125 gallon tank with nothing but plant decorations. > > Thanks. > > Jonathan Why not ditch the fake stuff replace with Mopani Wood? Tried and true. Looks way nicer also. Or check someplace like http://www.aquariumdriftwood.com/ . I don't know what Mopani Wood is, but I'll check out the link. Thanks. Jonathan > > Maybe. I will try some tests with my next water change. It sure would suck > > to have this large 125 gallon tank with nothing but plant decorations. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > Why not ditch the fake stuff replace with Mopani Wood? Tried and true. Looks > way nicer also. Or check someplace like http://www.aquariumdriftwood.com/ . I have a 35 gal hexagon tank with 4 Figure Eight Puffer Fish and One Gold Nugget Pleco. I purchased three Top Fin Tree Roots (small, medium, and large) not even a month ago. Yesterday I noticed that my fish were rubbing themselves against the decorations and they were developing ick. So i did a water change and noticed that the paint on the three tree roots was coming off. Also, you mention the smell, yes they do. I is a really funky odor and it doesn't go away. I will not purchase another deocoration from Top Fin again. >I reported problems earlier with my fish (local, freshwater, wild fish) >flashing against various surfaces even though the water parameters appear [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > >Jonathan |
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