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Pet Forum / Birds / Parrots / October 2003I have questions on my birdies that the books just don't answer
Just found this group and was hoping some kind people, knowledgeable about my cockatiels, would be able to answer my questions. #1... I have put a bird bath into my cockatiels' cages several times and they just ignore it... should I keep doing this or should I just give in and not try to have my birds take a bath? Some people I've talked to said to put them in the sink and mist them with water, but I'm afraid that they will catch a cold or something. #2... I've talked to several breeders in my area and half of them said that it is absolutely necessary that I remove the babies from the nest box at three weeks and hand feed them and the other half said that the parents know what they are doing, so I should just leave them alone. Any opinions? #3... My bird keeps laying eggs.... I have cut their daylight down to 10 hours a day for the last two months and the eggs keep coming. I was determined to remove the nestbox as soon as this latest baby left it, but she started laying eggs again two weeks after it hatched... so now I have one two week old baby and 4 eggs in the nest. I'd like to seperate the pair for awhile, but would it be safe to do this? The daddy sits on the eggs and feeds the baby during the day and mommy takes over at night. If I seperate them, there will be noone to take over for the missing parent? #4... Just when is it safe to remove the babies from the parents cage? My first set of babies left the nest box, but the parents kept feeding them for about two more weeks. I took them out when they finally had all their feathers, yet they still were chasing daddy around begging for food. Was this too soon, too late, just right? I'd like to thank everyone who can help me in advance for all your advice. Oh, just one more question... is there anyway to tell if the birds are boys or girls besides a blood test? > Just found this group and was hoping some kind people, knowledgeable about > my cockatiels, would be able to answer my questions. I will reply to the questions as they come. > #1... I have put a bird bath into my cockatiels' cages several times and > they just ignore it... should I keep doing this or should I just give in > and not try to have my birds take a bath? Some people I've talked to said > to put them in the sink and mist them with water, but I'm afraid that they > will catch a cold or something. Spray mist. Place hot water in the bottle and gently mist *above* them so that it falls down onto them. SOme take to it, some don't. > #2... I've talked to several breeders in my area and half of them said that > it is absolutely necessary that I remove the babies from the nest box at > three weeks and hand feed them and the other half said that the parents > know what they are doing, so I should just leave them alone. Any opinions? If you want to hand feed, remove the chicks, if not, then leave the parents to do it. > #3... My bird keeps laying eggs.... I have cut their daylight down to 10 > hours a day for the last two months and the eggs keep coming. I was [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > eggs and feeds the baby during the day and mommy takes over at night. If I > seperate them, there will be noone to take over for the missing parent? Seperating them will not stop the hen laying eggs.You need to remove the nest box whether eggs are in it or not, cut down the daylight hours, lower the temperature of their room and restrict their diet to seed alone to simulate harsh winter conditions in order to get their bodies to calm down.Separating strongly bonded pairs is cruel IMO.How would you like to be parted from your partner? If you don't want babies, then carry on with the daylight, plus temps etc. I will give you some links to follow. The methods *do* work if you stick to them. Failing that, simply boil the eggs and give them back to her (when they have cooled) You will also need to give her a calcium supplement as she will now be calcium deficient and prone to egg binding. > #4... Just when is it safe to remove the babies from the parents cage? When they are fully weaned and eating on their own and not being fed by the parents. >My > first set of babies left the nest box, but the parents kept feeding them > for about two more weeks. I took them out when they finally had all their > feathers, yet they still were chasing daddy around begging for food. Was > this too soon, too late, just right? Way too soon. When the parents stop feeding them, they are weaned. > Oh, just one more question... is there anyway to tell if the birds are boys > or girls besides a blood test? Different colour mutations can be hard to tell but basically, the hens have bars under the tail. I have to say though that for someone who has started breeding birds, you really don't seem to know a lot about them :0( Anyway here are the links to help you manage her egg laying. Just out of interest, what are you feeding them on a daily basis? http://www.cockatiels.org/articles/breeding/eggs.html http://www.wctropicalbird.com/bird%20education/egg_laying.htm http://www.aviannetwork.com/articles/eggs.htm > Thanks for all the advice, I'll give it a try. As for not knowing much about them, that is true. These birds were abandoned in an apartment and I took them in. I didn't know if they were boys or girls until the eggs started coming! Big surprise to me. The original three were in one cage when found, so I figured that they were all of the same sex. I was wrong. Now I'm reading everything I can find and making tons of phone calls. We all have to start somewhere, don't we? I must be doing something right though... one of the birds was bald when I got him, now he is fully feathered again. All three have put on weight and have gotten a clean bill of health from the vet. I even took the two babies (now 12 weeks old) to the vet last week, and they got the thumbs up too. As for what I am feeding them... they get a combination of pelleted food and something called nutriberries.. a mixture of seed and pellets. The parents also have a dish if nesting food. They all seem to like the millet sprays as a treat. They also have a little bit of our dinner every day... the fresh veggies, boiled chicken, pasta, fruit, etc. I have also been adding a calcium suppliment to the water as my vet suggested to prevent problems with the female. I need to wait until the baby leaves the nest box before I remove it, right? It's not safe to just leave the partially feathered baby on the bottom of the cage, is it? How low should the temperature in the room be? I have a thermometer in there now and it stays at a pretty constant 72 degrees? Should I change their diet now, or after the baby is weaned? Sorry for all the questions, but like I said, I'm trying to learn as much as I can, as fast as I can. I'll take a look at the sites you listed. Again, thanks a bunch. >> Just found this group and was hoping some kind people, knowledgeable >> about my cockatiels, would be able to answer my questions. [quoted text clipped - 78 lines] > > http://www.aviannetwork.com/articles/eggs.htm Change the diet AFTER the babies are weaned, and never give your birds a nest box again, if you are not interested in breeding. If they start laying eggs on the bottom of the cage, simply boil them or poke a hole through one end of the egg. After 3 weeks of sitting on them, they will realize that they are duds and abandon them, then and only then, remove the eggs. If you take the eggs on a cockatiel, she will continue to lay more until her desired clutch size is reached. Sometimes this could be 4 eggs, sometimes more. Cockatiel parents are like human parents, some a good, some are great and others, should never be parents at all. What those breeders told you about how you *must* remove the babies after three weeks is a load. If the parents have cared for them well by 3 weeks of age, they will continue to do so. I think maybe what the breeder meant was for you to pull the babies at 3 weeks and hand feed them yourself so that they babies will be handtame for pets. That is what most breeders do, but they usually pull the babies at 2 weeks of age. It is recommended to leave the babies with the parents for this long so that the natural gut flora will be aquired from the parents. I let my bonded pair raise the babies themselves but I handled them everyday as much as I could. Swayzie and Blue would come over to me and feed them when I would have them sitting in my hand! They are just the same as a handfed baby bird (I still have them because I just couldnt bare to part with them). Usually by 5 weeks the babies have taken their first jaunt around the room. I start giving the babies soaked seed and millet at 4 weeks old and slowly add in dry seed. Once they are eating on their own and flying, I consider them weaned even if they do beg for food every so often. I don't believe that there is a certain age to quote for a weaned bird, they are when they are and you will know. Every baby is different and it may take others longer to figure out how to eat and drink. > > Thanks for all the advice, I'll give it a try. As for not knowing > much about them, that is true. These birds were abandoned in an [quoted text clipped - 111 lines] > > > > http://www.aviannetwork.com/articles/eggs.htm Thanks for the advice! > Change the diet AFTER the babies are weaned, and never give your birds > a nest box again, if you are not interested in breeding. If they start [quoted text clipped - 152 lines] >> > >> > http://www.aviannetwork.com/articles/eggs.htm > As for what I am feeding them... they get a combination of pelleted food > and something called nutriberries.. a mixture of seed and pellets. Aha!! I think this is where your problem lies. You are feeding an enriched diet. This diet fools their bodies into thinking that it is summer time, and the best food is available, and they need to breed. I strongly recommend that you change to a seed based diet. This, plus reducing the daylight will fool the birds bodies into th inking it is winter and the quality of the food is not as high and hence the hormones decrease and they come out of breeding mode. Now, not wishing to be accused of being anti American again, I have long had this theory. You see, over there, lots of people feed pellets to their birds. Also, lots of people seem to have a problem with their hens laying themselves to death. Think about it.In the wild, out of breeding season, the days get cooler and shorter and food is poorer quality. In summer, weather gets warmer, days get longer, things start to blossom and sprout and birds come into breeding. Vets advocate pellets, people have problems with their hens, and vets get even more money from hormone jabs and from operating on eggbound hens.It is a vicous circle. >The > parents also have a dish if nesting food. They all seem to like the > millet sprays as a treat. They also have a little bit of our dinner > every day... the fresh veggies, boiled chicken, pasta, fruit, etc. I > have also been adding a calcium suppliment to the water as my vet > suggested to prevent problems with the female. The diet you are feeding is forcing them to breed. If you really care for them and want them to stop egglaying, read some of the links I sent you if you don't believe what I am saying about the diet. My own birds get a summer/winter diet. I start to increase fruit and stuff inn spring to bring them into breeding condition. I reduce it in autumn to stop egg production. It works, as simple as that. People are killing their pets out of kindness. Not just birds but fat dogs and cats etc. The parents just got seeds and nesting food today... they kind of looked at me like I was crazy or something. Should I change the diet of the other birds as well, or just the parents? I agree with what you say about the vets though. They always tell you what to feed your animals and it usually ends up being some really expensive mixture that you can only buy in the vets office. Needless to say, I don't do this. I have been feeding them the nutriberries because that is what the vet recommended when I took them in after being rescued. Maybe she suggested this type of feed because of the poor condition they where in when found. I don't know for sure. I do know that the vets in my area also recommend only rodant pellets for all my mice, gerbils and hamsters. I did just what you were saying, about thinking what they would eat in the wild... the nuts, berries, veggies, etc. This is what I feed my little critters and they have all lived a long and healty life. I have one mouse and a hamster that are going on 5 years now. I did read the articles that you linked to and I did do some of those things already... I've kept rotating toys in the cage, moved the cage from room to room in the house, shortened the lenght of their day, etc. Hopefully changing the diet will work since those things didn't. Thanks again for the advice. I'll let you know if things work out. >> As for what I am feeding them... they get a combination of pelleted >> food and something called nutriberries.. a mixture of seed and [quoted text clipped - 34 lines] > killing their pets out of kindness. Not just birds but fat dogs and > cats etc. > The parents just got seeds and nesting food today... they kind of looked > at me like I was crazy or something. Should I change the diet of the [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > Thanks again for the advice. I'll let you know if things work out. I know it is very hard to put them on a harsher diet. We all want to give our animals the very best, and treats ect. I understand that. Heck my cats get scrambled eggs and smoked salmon as a treat, the dogs get home baked dog treats and fresh bones, my parrots however only get treats in the breeding season. If it gives you confidence, I have kept birds for over 30 years. I have around 90 now, and do a little rescue, and breed some of my own. I have had one of our foremost zoos, place a bird with me. I hope this perhaps gives you some confidence in that I *do* know a little about birds and understand how to manage egg laying . I really hope you mange the diet change and that your birds cope with it. The fact that they are laying so many eggs is a tribute to how you have managed to build them up from poor condition, to fit for breeding. The thing is now to bring them down a little so that they stop breeding but still stay fit. Get a quality sedmix with not too much sunflower, offer very little in the way of extras, perhaps a bit of apple, or carrot once every other day, and millet no more than once a week. I feel sure that you will soon have the problem under control. Do let me know how you go on. You will need to keep this up by the way once they have stopped laying. You can start to improve the diet again in spring. Practice the summer/winter diet and you will surely have healthy birds, plus you won't have to worry so much :0) > <snip> > As for what I am feeding them... they get a combination of pelleted food [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > have also been adding a calcium suppliment to the water as my vet > suggested to prevent problems with the female. Fluffy, Nutriberries are usually fed as an treat, not as a regular part of the daily diet. I seriously doubt they have much more nutritional value than a good quality seed mix (read the ingredients), and they're a heck of a lot more expensive. My birds get one about 3 times a week. I quit buying pellets after 8 years of wasting money on something they didn't like. Now they get a seed based diet with lots of nutritional fresh foods everyday. They're much happier, getting healthier, and I have a little more money to spend on toys and stuff. :>)  SignatureMama ~^~^~^~ Visit Mamabird's Nest: <http://iluvbirds.tripod.com/> And My Photo Albums at: <http://photos.yahoo.com/iluvbirdz> ~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~ > Just found this group and was hoping some kind people, knowledgeable about > my cockatiels, would be able to answer my questions. [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > Oh, just one more question... is there anyway to tell if the birds are boys > or girls besides a blood test? Listen to OM,she knows her birds, I have learned how to pelvic check for the birds sex, If you roll the bird on to its back and feel its pelvic area, you will feel 2 bony protrusions, if the tip of you finger can fight slightly between the 2 protrusions its a female, if the 2 bone are tight together its a male, it definetly takes some practice, but it is accurate once you get the feel of it. Ive sexed a bunch of birds now that have been dna tested and have been correct 15 out of 15. |
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