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Pet Forum / Aquaria / Goldfish / February 2008Changing The Water
How long should I wait before I change the water? And how much water should I remove? (5 gallon tank). When it's time, I really want to remove all the water, and clean all the decorations, and of course the gravel. If I don't clean out the tank, and I just remove "some" of the water, the gravel will stay dirty. change as much water as needed to get rid of ammonia or nitrites. change water to keep nitrates under 20 ppm. >How long should I wait before I change the water? And how much water >should I remove? (5 gallon tank). When it's time, I really want to [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >If I don't clean out the tank, and I just remove "some" of the water, >the gravel will stay dirty. > How long should I wait before I change the water? And how much water > should I remove? (5 gallon tank). When it's time, I really want to [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > If I don't clean out the tank, and I just remove "some" of the water, > the gravel will stay dirty. Scrubby off any algae is fine, but you don't remove everything and dump all the water with each cleaning. The tank will never cycle. Please, please research on cycling a fish tank (nitrogen cycle). Are you working on bring back those goldies to the store? Tonight I changed 50% of the water, and added fresh water. Then I added a capful of AquaPlus to the water. I need to get that ph test kit. The manager at the store told me that AquaPlus is better than Stress Coat. No, I didn't take my Goldies back to the store. I have gotten too attched to them. > Tonight I changed 50% of the water, and added fresh water. Then I added > a capful of AquaPlus to the water. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > No, I didn't take my Goldies back to the store. I have gotten too > attched to them. So are you saying that instead of trying to keep 2 goldies in a 5g tank, that you are going to buy a suitable tank for them? A 29g is the bare minimum for 2. You were asking about Black Moores in another post. If you're thinking of getting even more goldies, you're going to need to purchase a large set up. If you can't go for the large (55g+) for them, then do what's right for them and take them back. They will not be able to live in a 5g. They may look "fine" for a while ....even with daily water changes. However, they're going to get stunted. That'll kill them. If that doesn't do them in, they'll die from their own waste in such a small tank (2 common goldies in a 5g tank is not ok). I don't think you realize how fast they will outgrow the 5g they're in now. So what are you going to do? If you really are attached to them, then you need to do what's right for them. As far as what that store manager is telling you..... How can you believe anything out of that guys mouth? He's comepletely bullshitted you already for a sale. Personally, I don't care for AquaPlus. It made a foam on the surface of the tanks it was used in. Stress Coat doesn't do that. NovAqua is also just as good as StressCoat. Amquel is their version for ammonia situations......something you might want to think about getting instead of AquaPlus. Goldies + small tank = high ammonia levels. Here's what you said before abotu that store mananger::: *************************************************** From: Romanta...@webtv.net (L u) Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2008 00:02:41 -0500 Subject: Re: How many goldfish can be kept in 1.5 gallons of water? I read about cycling, but I'm just a novice. The petstore manager said 2 goldfish were fine for such a small tank. But then I bought a 5 gallon. ************************************************** This is why you don't need to be listenting to anything this guys is telling you. Even though it's not exactly clear which tank (1.5g or 5g) the manager is claiming is fine for 2 common goldies, it doesn't matter. Neither is ok. Did you tell him you had found out that these fish can grow over a foot long...both of them (?!?!?!?!) for this 5g tank, and that he said that would be fine? I'm curious if you did, and if so...what he said. No I didn't tell her that Goldies can grow over a foot long. She's the manager of Petland. But when I purchased my first 1.5 gal tank, (which I no longer use)...I asked her if they would grow..she said yes. And as you know, she said 2 goldies were fine for the 1.5 gal tank. People are always calling her up on the phone to ask her questions she said...and of course, in person. She seems like she knows a lot. She always has the answers......But as you may be thinking, the wrong answers. Could be she thought 2 goldies were ok for the size they are NOW...in the 1.5 gal starter tank. > No I didn't tell her that Goldies can grow over a foot long. She's the > manager of Petland. This really makes no difference to me. The label doesn't mean they know anything. I've seen too many "managers" giving out very bad info to people. Sometimes it was so bad that I broke in and corrected them. I understand your apprehension (spelling on that word, I haven't a clue, lol) though. The day I heard the manager of a Petsmart tell 2 folks they could keep 4 Oscars in a 20g tank (that was in their cart and they were going to buy the 4 of them them too). He was on his way to get a bag and net when I walked over to them and explained how large these fish grow. Also the size tank they would need very quickly too.....and they changed their minds right away! But when I purchased my first 1.5 gal tank, (which I > no longer use)...I asked her if they would grow..she said yes. And as > you know, she said 2 goldies were fine for the 1.5 gal tank. People are > always calling her up on the phone to ask her questions she said...and > of course, in person. She seems like she knows a lot. > She always has the answers. Yeah, she sounds like the common moron running a pet shop. They sure sound like they know what their talking about, but in reality they don't. Or even worse.....they do and are doing it on purpose to make more money. > Could be she thought 2 goldies were ok for the size they are NOW...in > the 1.5 gal starter tank. Did she go on to explain that you'll need a much larger set up in the very near future? I doubt it. I'm glad you added your input to the people that were going to buy the 4 Oscars. You really care about our fish friends. :) No, she did NOT tell me that I'd be needing a larger tank. :-( > I'm glad you added your input to the people that were going to buy the 4 > Oscars. You really care about our fish friends. :) I care about the folks entering the hobby too. There's so much bull crappy out there, that you need to wear boots when listening to some of these shop employees! Folks should be able to get correct information from folks working there. If they don't know the answer...they should say so instead of bull sh.tting somebody just to give an answer. This is the reason many fail and then leave the hobby. I think fish tanks would be as common as the dog or cat *IF* the right info was out there. Heck, even a lot of books have bogus info in them. It's so hard and confusing for newbies to the hobby. Many have to re-learn everything they thought they knew was right. = / Even common feeder goldfish can reach a foot in a large clean tank or pond. Just look at my home page http://www.richdeer3pondsupplies.com for a picture of 2 star rose (red and white one). She was almost a foot and 8 years old in that photo and she was a $.28 fish. You should really take a look at the articles on the site as well. I agree that there is a lot of well intended but misinformed people in regards to goldfish. Just because they start small and are cheap DOES NOT mean they can live in anything. They do tend to tolerate a wider temp and pH range than tropicals and can start in a smaller tank. There is a good deal of debate on tank size for goldies. Filteration is most important than tanks size. If you need a cheap filter, look up homemade sponge filters which work great on small tanks. If you can't upgrade the tank size, increase the filtration and water changes. Overfeeding causes more problems than anything eles. In a 5 gallon tank you will find a small syphon hose ( about $4) the easiest way to go. If you take out a little every day maybe and inch or so it should keep things in balance. Keep a gallon of dechlorinated water near the tank. It will always be the same temp and handy for small changes. Tanks are not meant to be spotless but and taking it all the way apart isn't necessary every time.It's stressful on the fish as well. Think about how you would feel if someone chased yo out of your home, completely rearranged and threw you back in. I hope this info helps. You can also email me directly at richdeer3@yahoo.com Sincerely, Gail Hopkins, Owner Richdeer3 Pond Supplies On Feb 27, 12:55 pm, "iowa...@yahoo.com" <hopkins.g...@gmail.com> wrote: > Even common feeder goldfish can reach a foot in a large clean tank or > pond. Just look at my home pagehttp://www.richdeer3pondsupplies.com [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > richde...@yahoo.com Sincerely, Gail Hopkins, Owner Richdeer3 Pond > Supplies Given the right conditoins its amazing at how large a lot of the typical tropicals can get too. I kept a good asortment of various tropicals in outside preforms during warmer months (which is about 10 out of 12 months) in which water is warm enough for tropicals and have gouramis that are bigger than two hands in size..........and neons that are an easy 2+ inches in length. Even swordtails can get huge........ > On Feb 27, 12:55�pm, "iowa...@yahoo.com" <hopkins.g...@gmail.com> > wrote: [quoted text clipped - 35 lines] > > - Show quoted text - I completely agree with you on how large fish can get given a large body of water. When I see those kiddy pools you put out in the yard, I don't see my kids playing in them anymore. Now, I see fish "tanks"! lol They can be great grow out "tanks" for young fish. You do have to keep critters out though. You wouldn't want the fish to become food. > > On Feb 27, 12:55�pm, "iowa...@yahoo.com" <hopkins.g...@gmail.com> > > wrote: [quoted text clipped - 44 lines] > > - Show quoted text - I kept a breeding pair of angels outside allthis past summer long. They did fantastic and grew even more.......even the cory cats I put in there got much larger. I do keep a few fish inside in the summer so the tanks remain cycled, so they are readyto accept the outside fish once the weather gets too cool here for them. Never had any problems with themoutside except for my doxies wanting to jump in the preforms. I plant all the prforms very heavy espeically around the edges with plants you would normally findin aquariums......I have rthich beds of spiral val, and tons of camboba (sp? ) and aponegens sp? etc etc. in addition to typical pond plants like miniature (helvola) water lilies, sensitive vine (grows massive hairlike submerged roots which are fantastic for small fry to hide in and eat out of) frog bit water celery and Iris..............We have lights under the water and each preform has either a fountain or waterfall or both. Its much nicer seeing a school of platys or swordtails or a nice betta or gouramis in a whisky barrel than one or two goldies. ONe fish that we leave out all year round no matter how cold it gets and they always do fine is the blue paradise fish and the dojo (weather)loach. I have paradise fish that are over 5" long and have dojo loaches that are as big around as a ball park frank and twice as long...........all living in preforms outside. I will go check out the 29 gallon tanks. But, I'll need a stand. Yes, I see that foam on the top of the water surface. I didn't know of course, it was from AquaPlus. You know Tynk, I never knew Goldies grew past the size in which they were purchased. I guess I bought babies. That's how much I knew about goldfish! (Not much.) So by next month let's say, they will have grown even bigger? You said they grow fast. I'll go out to get the Amquel. Are you saying that with the Amquel, I won't need Stress Coat or NovAqua, or do I use Amquel also? I really appreciate your helping me along with my fish, Tynk. :) I am very inexperienced at all this. > I will go check out the 29 gallon tanks. But, I'll need a stand. Shop around for a good deal on tank/stand combo offers. A lot of the time you can find it cheaper if you buy it together. Do your homework though. Call around and find out prices of each item you need and their combo deals. You might be surprised at the difference in prices. The best deals on combos I found were *mom and pop* shops, or Pets Supplies Plus (locally owned chains). Don't forget when searching for the filter for it, you're going to want one for the next size larger tank (because these are goldfish and they put out more waste than most fish types), so an HOB (hang on back) power filter for a 45-55g tank would be great. Don't forget to look at what a small canister filter would cost too. It would fit inside the cabinet, where as the HOB obviously hangs on the back of the tank. The wood stands of today always look so flimsy to me and my hubby. For the 29g and the 75g he reinforced the wood. Not saying this has to be done, we just aren't fine with putting that much weight on a flimsy, pine stand. On the other hand there are some really nice oak stands out there, but they come with a hefty price tag. There's also the iron stands available if you prefer or don't mind them. > Yes, I see that foam on the top of the water surface. I didn't know of > course, it was from AquaPlus. Yeah, the bottle doesn't tell you the top of the tank is going to make a foamy mess. It's not hurting anything, I just don't like it. I like to be able to see clearly in my tanks. > You know Tynk, I never knew Goldies grew past the size in which they > were purchased. I guess I bought babies. That's how much I knew about > goldfish! (Not much.) Not many people do know how large they get. Sadly, most die long before ever reaching their true potential. This has been going on for many years with Goldies. The only way to change it is by teaching others. Now you know the real truth about goldies, and I know you're going to tell others. Hopefully, they tell others and on and on. > So by next month let's say, they will have grown even bigger? You said > they grow fast. As long as they aren't stunted, they should grow. At what % body size per month....I don't know. I specialize in Bettas and Angelfish (raised many batches of both), but haven't raised goldies personally. I'm hoping one of the others that specialize in goldies will chime in and give you the answers to the specific questions. > I'll go out to get the Amquel. > Are you saying that with the Amquel, I won't need Stress Coat or > NovAqua, or do I use Amquel also? Amquel is the water conditioner that not only treats chlorine, but tackles ammonia too. You don't use both. Amquel is the same as Novaqua and Stress Coat....just with a bonus chemical to hit ammonia. > I really appreciate your helping me along with my fish, Tynk. :) I am > very inexperienced at all this. � Thank you. I'm happy help. You are being very patient too! = ) Not every body takes being told everything they thought was right or ok was in fact the opposite, in such stride as you are. Every one of us was inexperienced at the beginning. The problem is misinformation from pet shop emplopyees, and new hobbyists not researching before heading to the store. You would naturally think you could get good info at a pet shop, but sadly it's rare. |
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