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Pet Forum / Mammals / Rats / April 2004



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Is Asprin safe?

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Susan Aplin - 24 Apr 2004 19:36 GMT
Hi everyone,
I think i remember reading on this group some time ago that junior aspirin
or paracetemol can be used a pain reliever for rats.Our Max has had a fall
and although we cannot see any sign of injury he seems to be
limping.Obviously i would take him to the vet if there was any serious
injury but i think he just may have sprained it.Is it ok to give him junior
aspirin ?Is paracetemol better and how much should he be given?I would
really appreciate your input on this.I would only use it if it was 100% safe
to do so.Thanks
Sue x
J&S Bouchard - 24 Apr 2004 19:47 GMT
> Hi everyone,
> I think i remember reading on this group some time ago that junior aspirin
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> to do so.Thanks
> Sue x

Hi Susan, your poor little guy will soon recover... he would recover best if
you could place him in a no level home for a wee bit of time. Anything to
stop him from using his leg. Baby aspirin can be giving to him. On PRC, an
excellent rat forum mentions that a vet prescribed 60mg of baby aspirin
every 4 hours for a 1lb rat, only if he seems in pain.
Sending healing vibes for little Max!!
Signature

Joanne
Mom to 12 rats
http://community.webshots.com/user/joanneb70
j-s.b@nospamsympatico.ca
remove "no spam"

paghat - 24 Apr 2004 22:32 GMT
> > Hi everyone,
> > I think i remember reading on this group some time ago that junior aspirin
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
> every 4 hours for a 1lb rat, only if he seems in pain.
> Sending healing vibes for little Max!!

Excellent rat forum my a.s! Not with advice like that which didn't get
corrected by ten horrified people who know better.

Aspirin has no pain relieving effect on rats. If it did, it would only
keep the rat from taking care of its injury until it healed; if pain is
not severe (thus requiring emergency veterinarian care) it should not be
treated with anything at all, because them knowing to limp means they know
to take care of their injury until it is better. Aspirin won't lessen
pain, but it will increase risk of bleeding disorders & will slow healing
of wounds. Here's tthe best, shortest profesional answer to the question:

"It has been determined that household drugs such as ibuprofen, aspirin,
and acetaminophen have no real effect on rat pain due to their high
metabolic rate and, therefore, should not be used. Heavy duty opioid
analgesics such as Butorphanol and Morphine administered frequently are
considered necessry in cases of severe pain. Less severe pain should not
be treated with medication at all as the pain ensures that the rat will
stay calm and speed the healing process." [-Mary Ann Isaksen and Diane
Newburg, RMCA].

And here's A REPOST: ASPIRIN & PET RATS:

It is pointless to use aspirin for pain relief in a pet rat when no such
relief can be delivered to a rat.

By & large, use of random household drugs for pet rats should be
considered severe abuse & neglect. If a rat is in sufficient pain to
require pain relief, then it is in sufficient pain to take to a vet. Even
if aspirin worked for pain in rats, which it does not, it would only
encourage the animal to injure itself by not carring sufficiently for its
own injury. Aspirin is not as toxic for pets as are the majority of
aspirin substitutes such as Tylonol, but it is still pretty bad. Every
year many children and pets die of aspirin overdoses and side effects.
Even small doses can be poisonous to pets.  There's no way around it; it
is irresponsible to give it to pets or even to children without
professional medical guidance, which should never be forthcoming for
treatment of pain since it will not work, but there are medical conditions
that MIGHT justify use of aspirin exclusively with veterinarian's advise.

Asprin will increase susceptibility to internal bleeding; will hamper
healing of bites or injuies; will make it impossible to safely undergo
surgery for, say, removal of a tumor; easily accumuilates at very toxic
levels to kill such a small mammal. Asprin can cause irritation and
bleeding in a rat's stomach. Asprin crosses the placental berrier & kills
fetuses in the wombs of pregnant mothers. It is metabolised in the liver,
where overdose will cause permanent liver dysfuction & probably death.

A number of ailments possible in rats decreases the ability of their
livers to process or their kidneys to expell silicates, so that even more
minute quanties of asprin will kill them quickly -- if it is being used as
a home remedy whenever some dolt thinks his rats are feeling poorly, the
ailment might well be one that retards rats' ability to process & expell
silicates, showing that it is not productive to guess at medication needs
without veterinary guidance.

Rats with hepatic or renal illness have a heightened probability of death
shortly after treatment with aspirin.  Rats already suffering from
gastrointinal problems will probably be killed by aspirin. Rats suffering
from weight loss caused by any illness or even by poor diet will probably
be killed by aspirin. Rats with sickly lungs, asthma-like conditions, or
diseases generically assumed to be "myco," are at heightened risk of being
killed by aspirin. Rats that already have black stools probably do have
some gastrointestinal troubles that will be worsened by aspirin, to the
point of death from internal bleeding.

For SPECIFIC ailments & with carefully measured doses as defined by a
qualified veterinarian based on each animals personal weight, there MIGHT
be
some safe & valid uses of aspirin, but not as delivered randomly without
qualified medical guidance, & not for relief of pain. Some uses we
presumedly would never need -- as for instance aspirin to increase
possibility of survival of being severely burned. Aspirin has assisted the
survival rate of rats treated with highly toxic cancer-treating chemicals,
but it is unlikely any rat of ours will undergo chemotherapy so won't have
this need. Rats with heart conditions or diabetes might be benefited, but
there is no prophelactic value to giving aspirin to healthy animals, no
pain-relieving value because of their high metabolic rate.

Asprin causes gastric mucosal damage even when used within
veterinarian-recommended dosages. So in the "best case" situation, it is
still harmful.

-paghat the ratgirl

Signature

"Of what are you afraid, my child?" inquired the kindly teacher.
"Oh, sir! The flowers, they are wild," replied the timid creature.
  -from Peter Newell's "Wild Flowers"
See the Garden of Paghat the Ratgirl: http://www.paghat.com/

J&S Bouchard - 24 Apr 2004 21:40 GMT
> > > Hi everyone,
> > > I think i remember reading on this group some time ago that junior aspirin
[quoted text clipped - 99 lines]
>
> -paghat the ratgirl

Well then, apparently Sue, don't use aspirin.
Paghat, do you have links to the documents which proves that aspirin and pet
rat don't mix? I would like to keep it on hand for future reference.
Thanks,
Signature

Joanne
Mom to 12 rats
http://community.webshots.com/user/joanneb70
j-s.b@nospamsympatico.ca
remove "no spam"

paghat - 25 Apr 2004 06:34 GMT
> > > > Hi everyone,
> > > > I think i remember reading on this group some time ago that junior
[quoted text clipped - 110 lines]
> rat don't mix? I would like to keep it on hand for future reference.
> Thanks,

That was written a long time ago, & was redacted from about two-dozen
published papers on rats & aspirin, some of which can be found with a
google search, others with a Medline search, others just not on the web,
most drawn from studies involving unhappy lab rats. But the RMCA FAQ
addresses the issue for pet rats per se, & you can find that quickly at
the RMCA website, though I did quote the relevant bit.

-paggers

Signature

"Of what are you afraid, my child?" inquired the kindly teacher.
"Oh, sir! The flowers, they are wild," replied the timid creature.
  -from Peter Newell's "Wild Flowers"
See the Garden of Paghat the Ratgirl: http://www.paghat.com/

J&S Bouchard - 25 Apr 2004 15:17 GMT
> That was written a long time ago, & was redacted from about two-dozen
> published papers on rats & aspirin, some of which can be found with a
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> -paggers

I'm not exactly sure that RMCA is the end all and be all of rat care.
The part you wrote was very well written and obviously researched, it made a
lot of sense. But then, just like I did, quote a vet on the use of aspirin,
turned out to be very wrong so I will be more careful in the future.
Signature

Joanne
Mom to 12 rats
http://community.webshots.com/user/joanneb70
j-s.b@nospamsympatico.ca
remove "no spam"

Susan Aplin - 25 Apr 2004 19:24 GMT
Hi Joanne,
Thanks for your advice.Having thought about it ,we have decided to see if
things improve in the next couple of days -if not,Max will be off to the
vets.We spent two and a half hours last night putting in more platforms and
ramps in the cage to make things easier for him to move around.He doesn't
seem to want to rest it,he is just moving more slowly.Thanks again.
Sue x

> > Hi everyone,
> > I think i remember reading on this group some time ago that junior aspirin
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
> j-s.b@nospamsympatico.ca
> remove "no spam"
J&S Bouchard - 26 Apr 2004 00:32 GMT
> Hi Joanne,
> Thanks for your advice.Having thought about it ,we have decided to see if
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> seem to want to rest it,he is just moving more slowly.Thanks again.
> Sue x

Hi Sue, I should have mentioned that along when giving any meds to try and
alleviate the pain, the rat should be taken out and put in a small cage with
no climbing or obstacles thus, limiting his activities.
I'm glad Max is feeling better.

Signature

Joanne
Mom to 12 rats
http://community.webshots.com/user/joanneb70
j-s.b@nospamsympatico.ca
remove "no spam"

elegy - 25 Apr 2004 03:16 GMT
>Hi everyone,
>I think i remember reading on this group some time ago that junior aspirin
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>to do so.Thanks
>Sue x

i wouldn't give him anything actually, as it could encourage him to
use an injured limb and injure it further. unless he's in severe
severe pain, in which case, i'd call the vet and ask them what to use.

---
"what does my body have to do
with my gratitude?" (ani d)
http://shattering.org
Susan Aplin - 25 Apr 2004 19:29 GMT
Hi Elegy,
We have decided not to give him anything because as you say it could lead to
further injury.He doesn't seem to be in any pain he is just slower and more
deliberate in his movements.We will give him two days and then he is off to
the vets.Thanks for your advice.
Sue x

> >Hi everyone,
> >I think i remember reading on this group some time ago that junior aspirin
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
> with my gratitude?" (ani d)
> http://shattering.org
jvc - 26 Apr 2004 04:17 GMT
hi Sue..the same thing happened with my rat, cgram..i put him in a one level
cage with a cagemate and after four days, he was fine and was back with all
the boys.
> Hi Elegy,
> We have decided not to give him anything because as you say it could lead to
[quoted text clipped - 26 lines]
> > with my gratitude?" (ani d)
> > http://shattering.org
Susan Aplin - 26 Apr 2004 07:49 GMT
Thats what we may end up having to do although it would be a last resort as
he would hate to be on his own again -his cagemate Shay would never tolerate
being in a small cage even for a few days.I don't want him being miserable
as well!Good to hear it worked well for your boy.
Sue x
> hi Sue..the same thing happened with my rat, cgram..i put him in a one level
> cage with a cagemate and after four days, he was fine and was back with all
[quoted text clipped - 32 lines]
> > > with my gratitude?" (ani d)
> > > http://shattering.org
 
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