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Pet Forum / Aquaria / Marine Reef / December 2006Copepods
Another Newbie Question: Are copepods the tiny white barnacle looking things that coat the rocks, etc? (That's what the guy that I bought the tank from told me.) Then I'm looking at this: http://www.reed-mariculture.com/copepod/ And, they appear to be a free floating insect like creatures. Reason I ask is that my Mandarin Dragonnet isn't looking very good. (It was also beaten up by a damsil). As far as I can tell, all the white crustations on the rocks (which it was eating) are gone. --Kurt > Another Newbie Question: Are copepods the tiny white barnacle looking > things that coat the rocks, etc? (That's what the guy that I bought the > tank from told me.) They could be, if they move. > Then I'm looking at this: > http://www.reed-mariculture.com/copepod/ > And, they appear to be a free floating insect like creatures. They walk on the rocks. > Reason I ask is that my Mandarin Dragonnet isn't looking very good. (It > was also beaten up by a damsil). As far as I can tell, all the white > crustations on the rocks (which it was eating) are gone. You need a refugium to keep them supplied. Mike > They could be, if they move. Definitely not then. These are calcified to the rocks. Hm, I wonder what other mis-information I accepted without questioning. No wonder he wanted to sell his tank. I know he added a trigger to a reef tank and ended up with limited live stock. btw, I was able to get the mandarin to eat frozen brine shrimp. Poor thing must be starved. It should hold him for a few days until the copepods show up. --Kurt > btw, I was able to get the mandarin to eat frozen brine shrimp. Poor > thing must be starved. It should hold him for a few days until the > copepods show up. I ordered some from http://www.inverts.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=CRA $17.50 for a 4 oz. bottle, plus $15.00 shipping. My situation is a bit different. I thought I had enough pods established, so I ordered a Mandarin. My wife works near the store, so I sent her down to pick it up when it came in. The store owner was on the phone, the kid bagging fish put two in the bag, and Elisabeth didn't know any better. So I ordered some pods and hope they'll co-exist ok. So far, one stays on the left end of the tank, and the other one tends to roam. There are brief fireworks when he/she roams over to the left end (which is to be expected). Neither one seems to be losing or gaining weight. George Patterson Forgive your enemies. But always remember who they are. HI George: Mybe you got lucky and got a male and a female. I have both the male has a spike on his dorsal fin and the female doesn't She also has lighter coloration on her head. They ge along great. Bill >> btw, I was able to get the mandarin to eat frozen brine shrimp. Poor >> thing must be starved. It should hold him for a few days until the [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > George Patterson > Forgive your enemies. But always remember who they are. > HI George: Mybe you got lucky and got a male and a female. I have both the > male has a spike on his dorsal fin and the female doesn't She also has > lighter coloration on her head. No such luck. I ran into a web site today with the same info you just gave. Both of mine are male. George Patterson Forgive your enemies. But always remember who they are. Hey George, I checked this site. A couple of questions: About how many copepods do you think you got with the 4 oz. bottle? Did you add the whole bottle to the tank to promote a population? or are you adding some everyday to feed your "couple"? Do you refrigerate the bottle? or are you using it for some kind of culture? I am dying for a Mandarin. I have Thousands of pods in my tank---but I hear they can be depleted quickly. I also have a bit of an alga and plant overgrowth---but now I`m thinking if I keep the tank just a little "dirty" than the pods have plenty of places to propogate. BTW---the tank is really cranking. Thanks again! Stringer > I ordered some from > http://www.inverts.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=CRA [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > George Patterson > Forgive your enemies. But always remember who they are. > About how many copepods do you think you got with the 4 oz. bottle? Dunno yet - I placed the order a couple days ago. I expect delivery Wednesday. > Did you add the whole bottle to the tank to promote a population? or are you > adding some everyday to feed your "couple"? I intend to dump the bottle in the tank. I can't imagine that the pods will stay alive more than a few days in that bottle with no food. > I am dying for a Mandarin. I have Thousands of pods in my tank---but I hear > they can be depleted quickly. I also have a bit of an alga and plant > overgrowth---but now I`m thinking if I keep the tank just a little "dirty" > than the pods have plenty of places to propogate. I've read that one should wait at least 8 months before adding a Mandarin, but I'd bet that something like this bottle of pods can establish a population earlier than that. I also read that a small pile of live rock debris (small pieces) can give copepods a refuge. The article stated that one can stick a piece of shrimp or something in the pile every week or so to feed them. BTW - if you're seeing lots of pods, they're probably isopods, not copepods. A big copepod isn't even as long as a pencil lead is wide (1 to 2 mm). I've read that they like to eat diatoms, which are pinpoint size white critters that tend to form a haze on the inside walls of a tank. I have tons of those, and there's other stuff swimming in the tank that's the right size to be copepods. Who knows what's in the sand. Both my Mandarins are picking at the rock, sand, and algae, and they aren't visibly losing weight, so I have my hopes up. George Patterson Forgive your enemies. But always remember who they are. What I am seeing are a multitude of tiny "commas" swimming freely in the water---those are probably the wrong type, right?. There are many other tiny organisms too. Sometimes when I shine a flashlight at night I see little meaty things spinning like whirling dervishes around the tank Little white spirals on the glass. But mostly I see tons and tons of those little "commas". Your gonna be surprised at how many pods a mandarinis capable of eating in short order. I have a mandarin in a 10 gal tank by itself. Yep thats not a typo either and its been in there for over a year now and doing fine. Its never been fed anything that I put into the tank like brine etc on a routine basis. On occasion I may add some brine shrimp and I have seen it pursue them, but its main diet has been copepods. Unfortunately the majority of mandarins die within a short period of time from starvation. I have thought about putting this guy in a larger tank for some time now, but its doing just fine for over a year so why mess with it. <<>>mtfester@netMAPSONscape.net wrote: <<>>> They could be, if they move. <<>> <<>>Definitely not then. These are calcified to the rocks. <<>> <<>>Hm, I wonder what other mis-information I accepted without questioning. <<>> No wonder he wanted to sell his tank. I know he added a trigger to a <<>>reef tank and ended up with limited live stock. <<>> <<>>btw, I was able to get the mandarin to eat frozen brine shrimp. Poor <<>>thing must be starved. It should hold him for a few days until the <<>>copepods show up. <<>> <<>>--Kurt ------- I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know! > Your gonna be surprised at how many pods a mandarinis capable of > eating in short order. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > never been fed anything that I put into the tank like brine etc on a > routine basis. That's great news for me, if I understand you correctly. Your 10 gallon tank maintains an adequate supply of copepods for one mandarin? Then my 125 gallon with ~130 pounds of live rock should be capable of supporting two. Is there anything special you're doing, other than having a bunch of live rock in there? George Patterson Forgive your enemies. But always remember who they are. No not really. I do have a fgood stand of calurpea and as much good live rock as I could possibly put in that tank and very little room for swimming, but then most mandarins rock hop and scoot around than swim anyhow, so its not like the mandarin is hurting for swimmning space it never uses anyhow. I find mandarins some of the neasted colored fish out there and they are dirt cheap in this reigon $10 to 15 bucks at most. Too bad they have such a strict type of diet. I also have a AC 500 / 110 hob filter on the back which funtions to provide current flow as well as provide a sort of fuge for "extra" pods as well. I have live rock rubble and chaeto in the fuge. <<>>Tristan wrote: <<>>> Your gonna be surprised at how many pods a mandarinis capable of <<>>> eating in short order. <<>>> <<>>> I have a mandarin in a 10 gal tank by itself. Yep thats not a typo <<>>> either and its been in there for over a year now and doing fine. Its <<>>> never been fed anything that I put into the tank like brine etc on a <<>>> routine basis. <<>> <<>>That's great news for me, if I understand you correctly. Your 10 gallon tank <<>>maintains an adequate supply of copepods for one mandarin? Then my 125 gallon <<>>with ~130 pounds of live rock should be capable of supporting two. Is there <<>>anything special you're doing, other than having a bunch of live rock in there? <<>> <<>>George Patterson <<>> Forgive your enemies. But always remember who they are. ------- I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know! > Unfortunately > the majority of mandarins die within a short period of time from > starvation. Not on my watch. <g> > > They could be, if they move. > > Definitely not then. These are calcified to the rocks. Hi Kurt, It's impossible to say for certain without a good photo but your description sounds like Spirorbis spp. Spirorbis is a sedentary polychaete that builds a tightly coiled calcium carbonate tube. They are known to occasionally 'bloom' in aquaria, presumably in response to food availability. I believe they generally disappear just as quickly (and mysteriously) as they appear. They are filter feeders and present no threat to your tank. OTOH: It's possible that their appearance could be a secondary symptom of excessive nutrients in your water (the primary being the appearance of whatever phytoplankton or bacteria they eat). You can see quite a lot of detail at about 20X magnification but an ordinary magnifying glass ought to enable you to identify them to genus. Here's a picture for comparison: http://www.biopix.dk/Photo.asp?Language=la&PhotoId=18604 Vermicularly yours, Alex > Spirorbis is a sedentary polychaete that builds a tightly coiled > calcium carbonate tube. Good guess, but no. They really look like very small barnacles. My mandarin had a great time eating them, and putting up a dust cloud in it's wake. I don't see any right now, but all my rocks are still coated with tiny white circles where they once were. --Kurt I have had 2 mandarin dragon without a happy ending. The first one I added too soon for pods to develop. The second one also die even when there were what I think was a substancial population of pods. (Now I have pods running free at nightime on my tank. Somehow my other fish doesn't seem to eat them). That fish needs special care when it come to eating and usually finish starving themselves. They are known to be very picky eaters, wanting only live food, however, you can try pellets, put them on a container where bigger fish can't eat it first. (I read that either on Melev or Don Geddis website, he was able to feed his dragon this way) It worths a shot. Sometimes, as we learn, mistakes are made, unfortunately at others expense(fish). And everyone here have had some losses. Good Luck. Ruben > Another Newbie Question: Are copepods the tiny white barnacle looking > things that coat the rocks, etc? (That's what the guy that I bought the [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > --Kurt Copepods are in a subclass of its own. They vary in shapes and forms but most of them are not easily seen with the bare eye. There are also Amphipods and Isopods which occur in great numbers in aquariums and are, in most of the cases, beneficial. No, if it can be easily seen moving, there is a 99% chances they are not copepods. http://www.museum.vic.gov.au/crust/amphigal.html http://www.tolweb.org/Isopoda http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copepod iy > Another Newbie Question: Are copepods the tiny white barnacle looking > things that coat the rocks, etc? (That's what the guy that I bought the [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > --Kurt > Copepods are in a subclass of its own. They vary in shapes and forms but > most of them are not easily seen with the bare eye. Wilkepedia says they run 1 to 2 mm in size. That's easily visible with the bare eye, but you *would* need a microscope to see all the little appendages and be sure it's a copepod. George Patterson Forgive your enemies. But always remember who they are. >> Copepods are in a subclass of its own. They vary in shapes and forms but >> most of them are not easily seen with the bare eye. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > George Patterson > Forgive your enemies. But always remember who they are. Yes, you can see something 2mm long with the bare eyes but to tell what is it? well, you need more detail, even a food flake moving with the current is that big iy My pods arrived. Wow! They are small. --Kurt > Another Newbie Question: Are copepods the tiny white barnacle looking > things that coat the rocks, etc? (That's what the guy that I bought the [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > --Kurt > My pods arrived. Wow! They are small. Yeah. Mine just arrived. You can't even tell if there's anything in there besides water. Hummmmm. Wonder if ........ George Patterson Forgive your enemies. But always remember who they are. >> My pods arrived. Wow! They are small. > > Yeah. Mine just arrived. You can't even tell if there's anything in > there besides water. Hummmmm. Wonder if ........ I can't say the bottle was teaming with pods, but then it was a fug starter package. I wonder how long the hatch cycle is. I need to get into the pod & live sand business. Maybe I'll get my kids to do it. Nobody would notice them scooping sand in colorful plastic buckets, and the fedex truck lugging them away. White gold! --Kurt > Another Newbie Question: Are copepods the tiny white barnacle looking > things that coat the rocks, etc? (That's what the guy that I bought the [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > --Kurt Yes, they are tiny free floating insect like creatures. Not sure what the barnacle like things you are refering to are... You can by live copapods online to feed your mandaring. Just google for "live copapods". Or your LFS may sell them. The more common brand is known as "tigerpods" |
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