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Pet Forum / Miscellaneous / Animal Health / June 2005Incontinent dog
We have a shepard/husky that is becoming increasingly incontinent and are considering his future. He is 80 lbs., approx 9-10 years old. We adopted him from the county shelter 4 years ago and at that time they guesstimated his age as 5 or so. He was neutered before we could bring him home. Bunker has been the WORLDS BEST DOG. Housebroken to perfection, well mannered, obedient, funny, intelligent, loving, PERFECT. He does have some allergies which we treat sporadically. This winter, he started dribbling urine. He will wet his bed, walk through the house or around the backyard and dribble and look at it in shock and dismay. He will dribble when scratched, scolded, excited, scared of thunder, or when getting up or turning a corner. He also will jump up from sleeping and run to the door, defecating all the way. He will urinate and defecate if his rear end is stimulated by being bathed. Bunker has also shown some weird gait changes-short lived but definitely there. Sometimes, when getting up, he will wobble or will be twisted to one side and his tail will be down and off to the right. After a short while, seconds to a minute, he returns to normal. He has had 1 month of PPA, 1 testosterone injection, 3+ weeks of Winstrol because during the process of trying to treat the incontinence a CBC showed he was extremely anemic-both white and red cell counts were very low with no "new" cells. A subsequent CBC has shown good response to the Winstrol with normal red cell and low-normal white cell counts after treatment. He will have another test at mid-month to be sure the treatment was sufficient. His tongue and gums are now normal in color and his personality (which had gotten rather grumpy and OFF) has returned to close to normal. He had 1 xray that didn't show any problems. He also had an ulcerated cornea that was very difficult to treat and resulted in a "flap" procedure being done and it failed on the 4th day and was not redone. The ulcer finally healed after a full month of various treatments. Does any of this indicate anything?? We can't continue with the incontinence issues as we like having Bunker in the house and not left in the backyard. Do all these symptoms equal anything treatable or even untreatable? Is this great dog on his way downhill? Thank you........... Has he been evaluated by another vet? If not my first choice to see if the first vet missed anything by taking him to an orthopedic vet. From the description you say he has some unusual things going on occasionally when getting up. It sounds to me like there may some orthopedic problems such as pinched nerves or some such thing. It may not be causing pain but could be causing sensation loss. Celeste > We have a shepard/husky that is becoming increasingly incontinent and are > considering his future. He is 80 lbs., approx 9-10 years old. We adopted [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] > > Thank you........... Thank you for your replies. We have seen 3 vets in the same clinic, but no one seems to feel the issues are serious. They have all said "too bad, not much we can do about the urinating." "The defecating sounds behavioral." And no one has considered the gait issues other than to suggest that if we think it's necessary, to consult a neurologist. If that is our next step, we will have to see if we can find the funds but I'm hoping someone here might be able to give us a clue or two as to what the problem might be so we can visualize what direction to go. I don't THINK we have a myelopathy issue, I don't THINK we have a spondylosis issue but I would like to hear if there are any other ideas out there. One possible suggestion is something about the parasympatetic nerve system, but again, I'd like to hear from other professionals before this gets any further. If the preponderance of opinion is neurological, we'll investigate that if possible, and the same for orthopedic. But we just can't afford to run bunches of expensive tests. I plan on getting a bit pushier at my vets office next week, but he's building a new clinic and seems to not have his attention on what WE consider important. But that's a whole different issue.......;>} I guess what we're really wanting to hear is whether it sounds helpless or curable and then we will try and make our decision. As you stated in your other reply on the other NG, if it was my Mother I'd take care of it, but SHE has insurance and the diapers she does wear now are affordable. I wish the same could be said for the boy. I hadn't considered the possibility of sensation LOSS, only that he doesn't seem to be in pain since he's a screamer and hasn't made a sound through all of this. The one xray didn't show any arthritis or tumors but I know 1 xray doesn't cover the whole body/spine on a dog his size. > Has he been evaluated by another vet? If not my first choice to see if > the [quoted text clipped - 62 lines] >> >> Thank you........... Why I think it's sensation loss is this statement you make where you say ............ Sometimes, when getting up, he will wobble or will be twisted to one side and his tail will be down and off to the right. After a short while, seconds to a minute, he returns to normal This describes Brandy's behavior exactly when she developed nerve paralysis. She had no feeling in the whole right side of her face and it progressed to complete paralysis in a months time. The only difference is she didn't loose bowl control to the extent that you describe your dog has. She ended up completely paralyzed but not before spending 3 days in the exact posture you describe. "Twisted to one side, tail down and off to the right and she could only walk in circles, when she was able to walk at all" In Brandy's case after discussing it with the orthopedic vet he described symptoms of facial nerve paralysis and paralysis of the 7th cranial nerve and his description fit her behavior the last 2 years exactly. He thought the paralysis was more than likely caused by the 7th cranial nerve having pressure on it either due to a brain tumor or lesion of some sort. Even with surgery and her age it was very unlikely that she'd make it so we chose to have her put to sleep. I hope there is something you can come up with. I hate to see a good dog put down if it's something that can be treated or dealt with that's why I suggested the diapers. Celeste > Thank you for your replies. We have seen 3 vets in the same clinic, but no > one seems to feel the issues are serious. They have all said "too bad, not [quoted text clipped - 91 lines] > >> > >> Thank you........... during the process of trying to treat the incontinence a CBC showed > he was extremely anemic-both white and red cell counts were very low with no > "new" cells. A subsequent CBC has shown good response to the Winstrol with > normal red cell and low-normal white cell counts after treatment. ...........what did they suppose the cause of the anemia was? Are you in tick country? buglady take out the dog before replying Oh my gosh...........the vet said possibly a virus, BUT my daughter came home from college in Hawaii last year just about this time of year and brought Hawaiian ticks home on her dog (she got her degree in animal science (?) and is going to vet school in Florida next year). I'm sure she told me they don't have tick borne disease in Hawaii, BUT I'm going to check with my vet today and ask if they checked for that in the blood work. I removed several ticks from all 3 of my dogs last summer, before getting rid of them (the ticks, not the dogs!). I haven't even considered that possibility, even though I'm in a Colorado where ticks can be a problem. They're just not where I live. However, don't antibiotics take care of that?? He's had a couple of rounds of them since last year because he licks his feet constantly (allergies) and gets infections in them. Could ALL these symptoms be attributed to Lyme's or some other disease? Or the treatments? I'm not that familiar with the possibilities. You can be sure that as soon as I send this reply, I'll be doing a bit of research while I wait for the vet to open. > during the process of trying to treat the incontinence a CBC showed >> he was extremely anemic-both white and red cell counts were very low with [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > buglady > take out the dog before replying I'm in a Colorado where ticks can be a problem. They're just > not where I live. However, don't antibiotics take care of that?? ...........Antibiotics have to be specific for the disease - just any old antibiotic won't work. Here's a page where you can read up: http://www.minden.com/nowhereelse/canine_tick_disease.htm > Could ALL these symptoms be attributed to Lyme's or some other disease? ...............YES, below is a compliation of possible symptoms from all tick diseases: http://www.mirage-samoyeds.com/tick.htm 2. What are the signs and symptoms of tick diseases? * anorexia (lack of appetite) * weight loss * fever * lethargy (mild to severe) * discharge from the nose or eyes (in puppies, sneezing or clear nasal discharge) * diarrhea (may contain blood or raspberry gel-like component) cough-deep or merely hacking * neurological signs including seizures, repetitive obsessive/compulsive actions such as chewing fur and/or licking legs, un-coordination or palsy * depression * vomiting bile (yellow and possibly frothy) stained fluid * hemorrhaging even when blood count looks normal * lightening of nose color * nosebleeds * blood clotting problems-even with normal CBC (complete blood count) * edema (swelling) of the extremities * muscle wasting * chronic ear and skin infections that do not respond to normal treatments ******* * low platelet count (thrombocytopenia) * ocular signs including bloodshot and glassy eyes, anterior uveitis, retinal hemorrhages, dilated pupils, photophobia *********** low WBC count (leukopenia) * elevated WBC count (leukocytosis) ************ regenerative or non-regenerative anemia ********** arthritis, unexplained lameness in one or all legs * weakness ********** pallor (pale gums or tongue) ********* incontinence * enlarged liver, spleen * liver, kidney failure * elevated liver enzymes or kidney function tests * increased thirst and urination ************ neck or back pain * bleeding under the skin or a rash (purpura) * enlarged lymph nodes * irreversible bone marrow suppression * protein in urine (proteinuria) * prostatic infections and/ or enlarged prostates in young, intact dogs buglady take out the dog before replying Follow-up: We have had bloodwork done and all is normal. No more anemia and the tick screens were normal. Does any veterinarian out there have any further suggestions?? > We have a shepard/husky that is becoming increasingly incontinent and are > considering his future. He is 80 lbs., approx 9-10 years old. We adopted [quoted text clipped - 37 lines] > > Thank you........... |
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