The INCURABLES <{}:~( >
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DelusionalDimensionsRecoveryDDR@i-love-dogs.com - 23 Aug 2007 20:35 GMT The INCURABLES <{}:~( >
HOWEDY FellHOWE Dog Lovers,
Jerry Howe, after dismally FAILING to educate our fellHOWE dog lovers on these forums to the absurdity of their reliance on their preferred use of bribery, avoidance, pain, fear, force, intimidation, surgical sexual mutilation and "euthanasia" as NECESSARY *(IN SOME CASES), came to the realization that we HAD been dealing with SCHIZOPHRENICS.
PUNISHMENT ALWAYS DERANGES BEHAVIOR.
Therefore, PUNISHMENT often WORKS WELL to "CURE" schizophrenia.
Consequently, Jerry Howe, despite his devHOWET ABHORANCE of the use of PUNISHMENT, had become The Sincerely Incredibly Freakin Insanely Simply AMAZING Grand Puppy Wizard, relying steadfastly on HIS modified hybrid koehler / Socratic method to identify, expose, and discredit the dog abusing mental cases, SUCCESSFULLY ridding these forums of their lies, abuse, and self gratifying nonsense.
For that reason you DON'T FIND the "old regulars" posting their lies, insanity and abuse here any longer. THEY LEARNED THEIR LESSONS WELL! My sincere appreciation is EXXXTENDED to wm. koehler, drs. sidman, dermer, plonsky, descartes, and of curse, Socratease!
HOWEver, what REMAINS are... THE INCURABLES!
The "regular" posters of today are NOT schizoid, they're PSYCHOPATHS, a.k.a., CRIMINALLY INSANE and PROBABLY INCURABLE <{}: ~ ( >
>From the article below: "It has been shown that punishment and behavior modification techniques do not improve the behavior of a psychopath. They have been regularly observed to respond to both by becoming more cunning and hiding their behavior better.
It has been suggested that traditional therapeutic approaches actually make them, if not worse, then far more adept at manipulating others and concealing their behavior. They are generally considered to be not only incurable but also untreatable.
Psychopaths also have a markedly distorted sense of the potential consequences of their actions, not only for others, but also for themselves. They do not, for example, deeply recognize the risk of being caught, disbelieved or injured as a result of their behaviour."
Therefore, further use of PUNISHMENT would be CRUEL, INHUMANE, and INEFFECTIVE. Henceforth, The Sincerely Incredibly Freakin Insanely Simply Amazing Grand Puppy Wizard MUST rely upon THE SAME techniques as HE TEACHES for the rehabilitation of fear aggressive DOGS:
UNCONDITIONAL LOVE, TRUST, and RESPECT.
Subject: R.P.D.B. Syndrome
http://www.phule.net/mirrors/unskilled-and-unaware.html http://www.apa.org/journals/features/psp7761121.pdf
UNSKILLED AND UNAWARE OF IT: HOW DIFFICULTIES IN RECOGNIZING ONE'S OWN INCOMPETENCE LEAD TO INFLATED SELF-ASSESSMENTS
Across 4 studies, the authors found that participants scoring in the bottom quartile... grossly overestimated their best performance and ability. Although their test scores put them in the 12th percentile, they estimated themselves to be in the 62nd.
- Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.
- Sufficiently advanced incompetence is indistinguishable from malice.
- Insufficiently advanced malice is indistinguishable from incompetence.
psychosis (si-ko'sis) Plural psychoses (si-ko'sez)
A mental state caused by psychiatric or organic illness, characterized by a loss of contact with reality and an inability to think rationally. A psychotic person often behaves inappropriately and is incapable of normal social functioning.
psy·chop·a·thy /sa?'k?p??i/ Pronunciation[sahy-kop-uh-thee] -noun, plural -thies. Psychiatry.
1. a mental disorder in which an individual manifests amoral and antisocial behavior, lack of ability to love or establish meaningful personal relationships, extreme egocentricity, failure to learn from experience, etc.
n.Mental disorder, especially when manifested by antisocial behavior.
Main Entry: de·praved Pronunciation: di-'prAvd Function: adjective: marked by moral corruption or perversion as shown by a capacity for extreme and wanton physical cruelty
Psychopathy
Psychopathy, or sociopathy, is currently defined in psychiatry and clinical psychology as a condition characterized by lack of empathy or conscience, and poor impulse control or manipulative behaviors.
It is a term derived from the Greek psyche (soul, breath hence mind) and pathos (to suffer), and was once used to denote any form of mental illness, often being confused with psychosis.
Though in widespread use, psychopathy has no precise equivalent in either the DSM-IV-TR, where it is most strongly correlated with antisocial personality disorder, or the ICD-10, where it is correlated with dissocial personality disorder.
Some experts are working toward listing psychopathy as a unique disorder. However, only a minority of diagnosable psychopaths are violent offenders.
The manipulative skills of some of the others are valued for providing audacious leadership.
Some have argued that psychopathy is adaptive in a highly competitive environment, because it gets results for both the individual and the corporations they represent. However, these individuals will often cause long-term harm, both to their co-workers and the organization as a whole, due their manipulative, deceitful, abusive, and often fraudulent behaviour.
In current clinical use, psychopathy is most commonly diagnosed using the checklist devised by Emeritus Professor Robert Hare. He describes psychopaths as "intraspecies predators who use charm, manipulation, intimidation, and violence to control others and to satisfy their own selfish needs.
Lacking in conscience and in feelings for others, they take what they want and do as they please, violating social norms and expectations without guilt or remorse" . "What is missing, in other words, are the very qualities that allow a humanbeing to live in social harmony.
History
Research into a group of individuals that could be described as psychopathic was first completed by Philippe Pinel almost 200 years ago.
Pinel described patients as "insane without delirium," which he characterized as a lack of restraint and remorselessness for their actions.
Pinel felt that his patients were morally neutral, reflecting his humanistic approach to mental illness.
The next most distinctive work on psychopaths was done in 1941 by Hervey Cleckley in his book The Mask of Sanity (significantly expanded in the second edition of 1950). Cleckley offered a broad range of case histories, from all corners of society, all of which showed patients with the common characteristic of "emotional emptiness."
Cleckley probed the psychopath's attitudes and thought patterns in search of a meaning for their unusual behaviour; however, according to Robert Hare, Cleckley's most important contribution was in providing the framework of emotion for most future research into this disorder.
What is a psychopath?
A psychopath has no concern for the feelings of others and a complete disregard for any sense of social obligation, though superficially they seem like a normal person.
They can be charming and polite on the surface, but this only disguises their lack of empathy. They seem egocentric and lack insight of any sense of responsibility or consequence.
Their emotions are thought to be superficial and shallow, if they exist at all. They are considered callous, manipulative, and incapable of forming lasting relationships, let alone showing any kind of meaningful love. They typically never perform any action unless they determine it can be beneficial for themselves.
Since psychopaths cause harm through their actions, it is assumed that they are not emotionally attached to the people they harm; however, according to the PCL-R Checklist, psychopaths are also careless in the way they treat themselves. They frequently fail to alter their behavior in a way that would prevent them from enduring future discomfort. Dr. Joseph Newman contends that the behavior displayed by psychopaths is the result of "an inability to process contextual cues."
It is thought that any emotions which the primary psychopath exhibits are the fruits of watching and mimicking other people's emotions. They show poor impulse control and a low tolerance for frustration and aggression. They have no empathy, remorse, anxiety or guilt in relation to their behavior.
In short, they truly are devoid of conscience.
However, they understand that society expects them to behave in a conscientious manner, and therefore they mimic this behavior when it suits their needs.
Most studies of psychopaths have taken place among prison populations. This remains a limitation on its applicability to a general population but that has not prevented fiction writers from popularizing psychopaths in the movies.
Cleckley defined psychopathy thusly:
1. Superficial charm and above average intelligence. 2. Absence of delusions and other signs of irrational thinking. 3. Absence of nervousness or neurotic manifestations. 4. Unreliability. 5. Untruthfulness and insincerity. 6. Lack of remorse or shame. 7. Antisocial behavior without apparent compunction. 8. Poor judgment and failure to learn from experience. 9. Pathological egocentricity and incapacity to love. 10. General poverty in major affective reactions. 11. Specific loss of insight. 12. Unresponsiveness in general interpersonal relations. 13. Fantastic and uninviting behavior with drink, and sometimes without. 14. Suicide threats rarely carried out. 15. Sex life impersonal, trivial, and poorly integrated. 16. Failure to follow any life plan.
It has been shown that punishment and behavior modification techniques do not improve the behavior of a psychopath. They have been regularly observed to respond to both by becoming more cunning and hiding their behavior better.
It has been suggested that traditional therapeutic approaches actually make them, if not worse, then far more adept at manipulating others and concealing their behavior. They are generally considered to be not only incurable but also untreatable.
Psychopaths also have a markedly distorted sense of the potential consequences of their actions, not only for others, but also for themselves. They do not, for example, deeply recognize the risk of being caught, disbelieved or injured as a result of their behaviour.
Legal definitions
Psychopathy has quite separate legal and judicial definitions that should not be confused with the medical definition. Various states and nations have at various times enacted laws specific to dealing with psychopathic offenders, and many ofthese laws are active, on statute, today:
Washington State Legislature defines a "Psychopathic personality" to mean "the existence in any person of such hereditary, congenital or acquired condition affecting the emotional or volitional rather than the intellectual field and manifested by anomalies of such character as to render satisfactory social adjustment of such person difficult or impossible".
California enacted a psychopathic offender law in 1939 that defined a psychopath solely in terms of offenders with a predisposition "to the commission of sexual offenses against children."
A 1941 law attempted to further clarify this to the point where anyone examined and found to be psychopathic was to be committed to a state hospital and anyone else was to be sentenced by the courts.
In the United Kingdom, "Psychopathic Disorder" is legally defined in the The Mental Health Act (UK) as, "a persistent disorder or disability of mind (whether or not including significant impairment of intelligence) which results in abnormally aggressive or seriously irresponsible conduct on the part of the person concerned."
Types of psychopathy
Cleckley also distinguished between two types of psychopathy: primary and secondary. Primary psychopathy was defined as the root disorder in patients diagnosed with it whereas secondary psychopathy was defined as an aspect of another psychiatric disorder or social circumstances.
Today, primary psychopaths are considered to have mostly Factor 1 traits from the PCL-R (arrogance, callousness, manipulativeness, lying) whereas secondary psychopaths have a majority of Factor 2 traits (impulsivity, boredom proneness, irresponsibility, lack of long-term goals) .
Mealey uses the term "primary psychopathy" to differentiate between psychopathy that is biological in origin and "secondary psychopathy" that results from a combination of genetic and environmental influences. Lykken prefers sociopathy to describe the latter.
Sellbom and Ben-Porath (2005) describe the distinction succinctly:
Some people who engage in violent behavior possess psychopathic personality traits, such as callousness, grandiosity, and fearlessness, and presumably engage in such conduct because they care little about others.
Others are impulsive and experience considerable anger, anxiety, and distress and may commit violent acts as a reaction to negative emotions, which are sometimes referred to as "crimes of passion."
Indeed, the distinction between primary and secondary psychopathy (including so-called neurotic psychopathy) has long been noted in the psychopathy literature (Karpman, 1947; Lykken, 1995).
This distinction closely resembles the distinction between instrumental and impulsive/reactive crime/violence in the field of criminology.
Joseph P. Newman et al. have validated David T. Lykken's conceptualization of psychopathy subtypes in relation to Gray's behavioral activation system and behavioral inhibition system.
Primary psychopathy
On the MMPI-2 Restructured Clinical Scales (RC), primary psychopathy (as measured by the Psychopathic Personality Inventory, Factor 1) is negatively correlated with RC2 (low positive emotions), RC7 (dysfunctional negative emotions), RC4 (antisocial behavior), and RC9 (hypomanic activation). On the MMPI-2 Personality Psychopathology Five (PSY-5) scales, primary psychopathy was positively correlated with aggression (Specifically, grandiosity and interpersonal dominance, and instrumental aggression). and DISC(onstraint) (specifically, fearlessness) while being negatively correlated with NEGE (negative emotionality) and INTR(oversion).
Newman et al. found measures of primary psychopathy to be negatively correlated with Gray's behavioral inhibition system, a construct intended to measure behavioral inhibition from cues of punishment or nonreward.
Secondary psychopathy
Secondary psychopaths show normal to above-normal physiological responses to (perceived) potential threats. Their crimes tend to be unplanned and impulsive with little thought of the consequences. They have hot tempers and are prone to reactive aggression. They experience normal to above- normal levels of anxiety but are nevertheless highly stimulus seeking and have trouble tolerating boredom.
Their lifestyle may lead to depression and even suicide.
For the secondary psychopath especially prominent are the Factor 2 (in the two-factor model) PCL-R items of impulsivity, weak behavioral controls, irresponsibility, lack of realistic long- term goals, proneness to boredom/need for stimulation, parasitic lifestyle, early behavioral problems, juvenile delinquency, and revocation of conditional release (breaking probation).
Sellbom and Ben-Porath (2005) found that secondary psychopathy (as measured by the Psychopathic Personality Inventory, Factor 2) shows opposite correlations to primary psychopathy in many cases.
On the MMPI-2 RC, secondary psychopathy is positively correlated with RC4 (asb), RC7 (dne), and RC9 (hpm). It was also found to be correlated with the MMPI-2 PSY-5 scales of AGGR(ession) and DISC(onstraint).
Newman et al. found measures of secondary psychopathy to be positively correlated with Gray's behavioral activation system, a construct intended to measure sensitivity to cues of behavioral approach.
Diagnostic Criteria, The PCL-R Assessment The PCL-R has allowed for a differentiation of individuals with psychopathy and antisocial personality disorder (APD).
In contemporary research and clinical psychiatry |clinical practice, psychopathy is most commonly assessed with the PCL-R (Hare, 1991), which is a clinical rating scale with 20 items. Each of the items in the PCL-R is scored on a three- point (0, 1, 2) scale according to two factors. PCL-R Factor 2 is associated with reactive anger, anxiety, increased risk of suicide, criminality, and impulsive violence.
PCL-R Factor 1, in contrast, is associated with extroversion and positive affect. Factor 1, the so-called core personality traits of psychopathy, may even be beneficial for the psychopath (in terms of nondeviant social functioning).
A psychopath will score high on both factors, whereas someone with APD will score high only on Factor 2.
Both case history and a semi-structured interview are used in the analysis.
Psychopathy's relationship with other mental disorders
Psychopathy, as measured on the PCL-R, is negatively correlated with all DSM-IV Axis I disorders except substance abuse disorders.
Psychopathy is most strongly correlated with DSM-IV antisocial personality disorder. PCL-R Factor 1 is correlated with narcissistic personality disorder and histrionic personality disorder. PCL-R Factor 2 is particularly strongly correlated to antisocial personality disorder and criminality.
PCL-R Factor 2 is associated with reactive anger, anxiety, increased risk of suicide, criminality, and impulsive violence. PCL-R Factor 1, in contrast, is associated with extroversion and positive affect.
The official stance of the American Psychiatric Association as presented in the DSM-IV-TR is that psychopathy and sociopathy are obsolete synonyms for antisocial personality disorder.
The World Health Organization takes a similar stance in its ICD-10 by referring to psychopathy, sociopathy, antisocial personality, asocial personality, and amoral personality as synonyms for dissocial personality disorder.
Among laypersons and professionals, there is much confusion about the meanings and differences between psychopathy, sociopathy, antisocial personality disorder, and dissocial personality disorder.
Sociopathy
The difference between sociopathy and psychopathy, according to Hare, may "reflect the user's views on the origins and determinates of the disorder.
Most sociologists, criminologists and even some psychologists believe the disorder is caused by social conflicts, and thus prefer the term 'sociopath.'
Those who believe as Hare does, that a combination of psychological, biological, genetic and environmental factors all contribute to the disorder are more likely to use the term 'psychopath'.
David T. Lykken proposes that psychopathy and sociopathy are two distinct kinds of antisocial personality.
He holds that psychopaths are born with temperamental differences such as impulsivity, cortical underarousal, and fearlessness that lead them to risk-seeking behavior and an inability to internalize social norms; sociopaths, on the other hand, have relatively normal temperaments; their personality disorder being more an effect of negative sociological factors like parental neglect, delinquent peers, poverty, and extremely low or extremely high intelligence.
Both personality disorders are, of course, the result of an interaction between genetic predispositions and environmental factors, but psychopathy leans towards the hereditary whereas sociopathy tends towards the environmental.
Antisocial personality disorder
Comparing psychopathy to antisocial personality disorder is a continuing source of debate within the psychological community. The official stance of the American Psychiatric Association as presented in the DSM-IV-TR is that psychopathy and sociopathy are obsolete synonyms for antisocial personality disorder (APD).
The World Health Organization takes a similar stance in its ICD-10 by referring to psychopathy, sociopathy, antisocial personality, asocial personality, and amoral personality as synonyms for dissocial personality disorder.
Hare and others take the stance that psychopathy as a syndrome should be considered distinct from the DSM-IV's antisocial personality disorder construct. even though APD and psychopathy were intended to be equivalent in the DSM-IV.
However, those who created the DSM-IV felt that there was too much room for subjectivity on the part of clinicians when identifying things like remorse and guilt; therefore, the DSM-IV panel decided to stick to observable behaviour, namely socially deviant behaviours.
As a result, the diagnosis of APD is something that the "majority of criminals easily meet.
Hare goes further to say that the percentage of incarcerated criminals that meet the requirements of APD is somewhere between 80 to 85%, whereas only about 20% of these criminals would qualify for a diagnosis of psychopath. This twenty percent, according to Hare, accounts for 50% of all the most serious crimes committed, including half of all serial and repeat rapists. According to FBI reports 44% of all police officer murders in 1992 were committed by psychopaths.
One study found that only 20 percent of those diagnosed with APD qualified as psychopath on the PCL-R.
Another study using the PCL-R to examine the relationship between antisocial behaviour and suicide found that suicide history was strongly correlated to PCL-R Factor 2 (reflecting antisocial deviance) and was not correlated to PCL-R factor 1 (reflecting affective functioning). Given that APD relates to Factor 2, whereas psychopathy relates to both factors, this would confirm Hervey Cleckley's assertion that psychopaths are relatively immune to suicide. Sufferers of APD, on the other hand, have a relatively high suicide rate.
Pseudopsychopathic personality disorder
It has been suggested that people can suffer apparently psychopathic personality changes from lesions or damage of the brain's frontal lobe . This is sometimes called Pseudopsychopathic personality disorder or Frontal lobe disorder.
One well-known and dramatic case was that of Phineas Gage, a 19th century railroad work supervisor, who had been relatively mild-tempered before the damage to his brain occurred.
According to Renato M. E. Sabbatini, an explosive charge was set. When it detonated, a steel rod was accidentally driven through Gage's skull from his left cheek to above the ight brow.
Incredibly, he survived for many years. According to the common account, his personality changed completely. He became abusive, aggressive, deceitful, irresponsible and incapable of insight and planning (a poor sense of consequence). Computerized reconstructions of the possible brain damage suggest that, from his known injuries he seemed likely to have had a lesion on the ventromedial frontal cortex.
However, Malcolm Macmillian's recent research into the Gage case shows evidence that many of the so- called "psychopathic" features were never documented by physician John Harlow, the primary source, or the Harvard physicians who examined him intensively in Boston. No police records or newspaper accounts can be found for Gage's alleged drunken behavior or violence, nor any record of his mother complaining to Dr. Harlow, despite being in contact for years.
Macmillan suggests that claims of deceitfulness, social coarsening and loutish behavior, in Harlow's report to the medical society, lack justification.
His research also showed that Gage was able to hold steady work in two locations. His drifting from job to job happened at the end of his life when he developed seizures, eventually succumbing to status epilepticus in front of his family. Macmillan concluded that, at worst, Gage was probably guileless and lacked social skills. A hotel guest, basically a stranger, convinced him to travel to Chile and manage a Concord stagecoach, a difficult cognitive-motor task, which he apparently mastered.
Childhood precursors
Psychopathy is not normally diagnosed in children or adolescents, and some jurisdictions explicitly forbid diagnosing psychopathy and similar personality disorders in minors.
Psychopathic tendencies can sometimes be recognized in childhood or early adolescence and, if recognised, are diagnosed as conduct disorder. It must be stressed that not all children diagnosed with conduct disorder grow up to be psychopaths, or even disordered at all, but these childhood signs are found in significantly higher proportions in psychopaths than in the general population.
Conduct disorder, as well as its subcategory Oppositional Defiance Disorder, can sometimes develop into adult psychopathy. However, conduct disorder "fails to capture the emotional, cognitive and interpersonality traits - egocentricity, lack of remorse, empathy or guilt - that are so important in the diagnosis of psychopathy.
Children showing strong psychopathic precursors often appear immune to punishment; nothing seems to modify their undesirable behavior. Consequently parents usually give up, and the behavior worsens.
The following childhood indicators are to be interpreted not as to the type of behavior, but as to its relentless and unvarying occurrence.Not all must be present concurrently, but at least a number of them need to be present over a period of years:
* An extended period of bedwetting past the preschool years that is not due to any medical problem.
* Cruelty to animals beyond an angry outburst.
* Firesetting and other vandalism. Not to be confused with playing with matches, which is not uncommon for preschoolers. This is the deliberate setting of destructive fires with utter disregard for the property and lives of others.
* Lying, often without discernible objectives, extending beyond a child's normal impulse not to be punished. Lies that are so extensive that it is often impossible to know lies from truth.
* Theft and truancy.
* Aggression to peers, not necessarily physical, which can include getting others into trouble or a campaign of psychological torment.
The three indicators - bedwetting, cruelty to animals and firestarting, known as the MacDonald triad - were first described by J.M. MacDonald as indicators of psychopathy. Though the relevance of these indicators to serial murder etiology has since been called into question, they are considered relevant to psychopathy.
The question of whether young children with early indicators of psychopathy respond poorly to intervention compared to conduct disordered children without these traits has only recently been examined in controlled clinical research. The findings from this research are consistent with broader evidence - pointing to poor treatment outcomes.
Discrete taxon vs. continuous dimension
As part of the larger debate on whether personality disorders are distinct from normal personality or extremes on various dimensions of normal personality is the debate on whether psychopathy represents something "qualitatively different" from normal personality or a "continuous dimension" shading from normality into severely psychopathic.
Early taxonometric analysis from Harris and colleagues indicated that a discrete category may underlie psychopathy, however this was only found for the behavioural Factor 2 items, indicating that this analysis may be related to Anti-social Personality Disorder rather than psychopathy per se.
John Marcus, and Edens performed some statistical analysis on previously attained PCL-R and PPI scores and concluded that psychopathy may best be conceptualized as having a "dimensional latent structure" like depression.
In contrast, the PCL-R sets a score of 30 out of 40 for North American male inmates as its cut-off point for a diagnosis of psychopathy, however this is an abitrary cut-off and should not be taken to reflect any sort of underlying structure for the disorder.
Perceptual/emotional recognition deficits
In a 2002 study, David Kosson and Yana Suchy, et al. asked psychopathic inmates to name the emotion expressed on each of 30 faces; compared to controls, psychopaths had a significantly lower rate of accuracy in recognizing disgusted facial affect but a higher rate of accuracy in recognizing anger.
Additionally, when "conditions designed to minimize the involvement of left-hemispheric mechanisms" were used, psychopaths had more difficulty accurately identifying emotions.
This study did not replicate Blaire, et al. (1997)'s findings that psychopaths are specifically less sensitive to nonverbal cues of fear or distress.
Also, in a 2002 experiment, Mitchell Blair et al. used the Vocal Affect Recognition Test to measure psychopaths' recognition of the emotional intonation given to connotatively neutral words. Psychopaths tended to make more recognition errors than controls with a particularly high rate of error for sad and fearful vocal affect.
Kristina D. Hiatt, William A. Schmitt, Joseph Newman conducted an experiment in 2004 to test the hypothesis of overselective attention in psychopaths using two forms of the Stroop color- word and picture-word tasks: with color/picture and word separated and with color/picture and word together.
They found that in the separated Stroop tasks, psychopaths performed significantly worse than controls; however, on standard Stroop tasks, psychopaths performed equally well as controls.
When split into low-anxious and high-anxious groups, low-anxious psychopaths and low-anxious controls showed less interference on the separated Stroop tasks than their high-anxious counterparts; for low- anxious psychopaths, interference was very nearly zero. They conclude that the inability to integrate contextual cues depends on the cues' relationship to "the deliberately attended, goal-relevant information."
See also
Psychopathy Checklist-Revised (PCL-R) Conduct disorder Oppositional defiant disorder Antisocial personality disorder Crime Serial killer Narcissistic personality disorder Sadistic personality disorder Fictional portrayals of psychopaths in film Fictional portrayals of psychopaths in literature Malignant narcissism Mind game
References Further reading
Cleckley, Hervey M. The Mask of Sanity: An Attempt to Reinterpret the So-Called Psychopathic Personality, 5th Edition, revised 1984, PDF file download.
Cooke DJ, Michie C (2001). "Refining the construct of psychopathy: towards a hierarchical model". Psychological assessment 13 (2): 171-88.
Hare, Robert D Without Conscience.
Hare, Robert D with Paul Babiak Snakes in Suits: When Psychopaths Go to Work (2006) Hill CD, Neumann CS, Rogers R (2004). "Confirmatory factor analysis of the psychopathy checklist: screening version in offenders with axis I disorders".
Psychological assessment 16 (1): 90-5. Neumann CS, Vitacco MJ, Hare RD, Wupperman P (2005). "Reconstruing the "reconstruction" of psychopathy: a comment on Cooke, Michie, Hart, and Clark". J. Personal. Disord. 19 (6): 624-40.
Patrick, Christopher J. (2006) Handbook of Psychopathy.
Michael H. Thimble, F.R.C.P., F.R.C. Psych. Psychopathology of Frontal Lobe Syndromes.
External links
Without Conscience Official web site for Dr. Robert Hare Malatesti, L, Psychopathy in Psychiatry and Philosophy: An Annotated Bibliography O'Connor, T, Antisocial Personality, Sociopathy and Psychopathy RCMP Gazette Vol. 66, Issue 3 2004, The psychopathic offender Understanding The Psychopath: (Key Definitions & Research)
In Love And Light, I Remain Respectfully, Humbly Yours, Jerry Howe, The Sincerely Incredibly Freakin Insanely Simply A-M-A-Z-I-N-G G-R-A-N-D Puppy, Child, Pussy, Birdy, Goat, Ferret, Monkey, SpHOWES And Horsey Wizard <{) ; ~ ) >
HOWE MAY I SERVE YOU <{}; ~ ) >
samvaknin - 24 Aug 2007 11:37 GMT Hi,
For a more detailed view of pathological narcissism and the Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD) - click on these links:
http://malignantselflove.tripod.com/npdglance.html
http://malignantselflove.tripod.com/narcissismglance.html
Other Personality Disorders
http://malignantselflove.tripod.com/faqpd.html
NPD (Narcissistic Personality Disorder) and AsPD (Antisocial Personality Disorder, Psychopathy, or Sociopathy)
http://samvak.tripod.com/personalitydisorders16.html
http://samvak.tripod.com/personalitydisorders15.html
Serial and mass killers
http://malignantselflove.tripod.com/serialkillers.html
School shootings
http://malignantselflove.tripod.com/9.html
Narcissism and Evil
http://malignantselflove.tripod.com/journal65.html
Is the Narcissist Legally Insane?
http://malignantselflove.tripod.com/personalitydisorders49.html
Take care.
Sam
Human_And_Animal_Behavior_Forensic_Sciences_Research_Laboratory@HotMail.Com - 24 Aug 2007 17:38 GMT HOWEDY Dr. Sam,
Welcome to Human And Animal Behavior Forensic Sciences Research Laboratory. I'm Jerry Howe, Director Of Research, a.k.a., The Sincerely Incredibly Freakin Insanely Simply Amazing Grand Puppy, Child, Pussy, Birdy, Goat, Ferret, Monkey, SpHOWES, And Horsey Wizard <{}: ~ ) >
Here's my website: http://www.freewebs.com/thesimplyamazingpuppywizard
> Hi, > [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] > > Sam Thank you for responding with further information. I've enjoyed your website and will continue studying it when I return from my appointments today and will apprise you of my uneducated opinions of your scholarly works.
>From your website: Someone is considered mentally "ill" if:
His conduct rigidly and consistently deviates from the typical, average behaviour of all other people in his culture and society that fit his profile (whether this conventional behaviour is moral or rational is immaterial), or
His judgment and grasp of objective, physical reality is impaired, and
His conduct is not a matter of choice but is innate and irresistible, and
His behavior causes him or others discomfort, and is
Dysfunctional, self-defeating, and self-destructive even by his own yardsticks.
-----------------
According to those critteria, it is I who is INSANE!
>From your website: It would seem that sanity and insanity are relative terms, dependent on frames of cultural and social reference, and statistically defined. There isn't - and, in principle, can never emerge - an "objective", medical, scientific test to determine mental health or disease unequivocally.
VIII. Adaptation and Insanity - (correspondence with Paul Shirley, MSW)
"Normal" people adapt to their environment - both human and natural.
"Abnormal" ones try to adapt their environment - both human and natural - to their idiosyncratic needs/profile.
If they succeed, their environment, both human (society) and natural is pathologized.
Descriptive criteria aside, what is the essence of mental disorders? Are they merely physiological disorders of the brain, or, more precisely of its chemistry? If so, can they be cured by restoring the balance of substances and secretions in that mysterious organ? And, once equilibrium is reinstated - is the illness "gone" or is it still lurking there, "under wraps", waiting to erupt?
Are psychiatric problems inherited, rooted in faulty genes (though amplified by environmental factors) - or brought on by abusive or wrong nurturance?
These questions are the domain of the "medical" school of mental health.
Others cling to the spiritual view of the human psyche. They believe that mental ailments amount to the metaphysical discomposure of an unknown medium - the soul. Theirs is a holistic approach, taking in the patient in his or her entirety, as well as his milieu.
-------------
Here's some further research, Dr. Sam:
Abuse / fear / aggression / hyperactivity / shyness / suicide attempts AIN'T a chemical imbalance or genetic problem, it's a SPIRITUAL problem, passed on from WON generatiHOWEN of abuser to the next, like the 100th monkey washin fruit in the stream; After a while it's not just NORMAL, it's OBLIGATORY.
To do otherWIZE would be DISRESPECTFUL of your parental teachins.
The Puppy Wizard's SYNDROME Is the Perfect Synergy Of Love, Pride, Desire, Shame, Greed, Ego, Fear, Hate, Reflex, Self Will, Arrogance, Ignorance, Predjudice, Cowardice, Disbelief, Jealousy, Embarrassment, Embellishment, Guilt, Anger, Hopelessness, Helplesness, Aversion, Attraction, Inhibition, Revulsion, Repulsion, Change, Permanence, Enlightenment, Insult, Attrition, And Parental / ReligiHOWES / Societal Conditioning.
YOU ARE THE CRITTER YOU WAS TRAINED.
It Is The Perfect Fusion Of The Word..., In The Physical. The Sincerely Incredibly Freakin Insanely Simply A-M-A-Z-I-N-G G-R-A-N-D Puppy, Child, Pussy, Birdy, Goat, Ferett, Monkey SpHOWES And Horsey Wizard <{) ; ~ ) >
"Only the unenlightened speak of wisdom and right action as separate, not the wise.
If any man knows one, he enjoys the fruit of both.
The level which is reached by wisdom is attained through right action as well.
He who perceives that the two are one knows the truth."
"Even the wise man acts in character with his nature, indeed all creatures act according to their natures.
What is the use of compulsion then?
The love and hate which are aroused by the objects of sense arise from Nature, do not yield to them.
They only obstruct the path," - - Bhagavad Gita, adapted by Krishna with permission from His OWN FREE copy of The Simply Amazing Puppy Wizard's FREE Wits' End Dog Training Method manual <{) ; ~ ) >
--------------------------
The Methods, Principles And Philosophy Of Behavior Never Change, Or They'd Not Be Scientific And Could Not Obtain Consistent, Reliable, Fast, Effective, Safe Results For All Handler's And All Critters, And ALL Behaviors In ALL FIELDS And ALL UTILITIES, ALL OVER The Whole Wild World, NEARLY INSTANTLY, As Taught In Your Own FREE Copy Of The Sincerely Incredibly Freakin Insanely Simply A-M-A-Z-I-N-G G-R-A-N-D Puppy, Child, Pussy, Birdy, Goat, Ferret, Monkey SpHOWES And Horsey Wizard's 100% CONSISTENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL ***FREE*** WWW Wits' End Dog, Child, Kat, Goat, Ferret, Monkey SpHOWES And Horsey Training Method Manual<{) ; ~ )>
----------------
Here's a couple of my contemporaries, or should we say, a couple other MENTAL CASES?:
On Aug 22, 11:55 am, dan...@netscape.net wrote:
> Hmmm... > > Interesting, sounds oddly familiar! INDEED?
>http://www.dogmastersystem.com/?gclid=CPTLhfqniY4CFRUHWAodclG9Eg Ahhh, Dr. Gene Dare Miller and our old friend Dr. Larry Male PRYOR to studying his own FREE COPY of The Simply Amazing Puppy Wizard's 100% CONSISTENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE WWW Wits' End Training Method Manual!
ENJOY!!:
Dr. Larry Male (a.k.a. TooCool) ruminates on Dog Behavior and Dog Training
Dr. Larry Male, Engineer, Scientist and Mathematician, writes to Dr. Miller about his dog Duke, the importance of DOG-MASTER®, and his opinion on other dog "training" methods.
Dear Dr. Miller,
It was such a pleasure for me to talk with you on the phone this morning.
I never did see your television appearances although they were well within my era. I think that I am perhaps 15 years your junior. I wish I had seen them though.
It was a little ad in Dog Fancy, I think, that I initially responded to back in 1992. I remember that the wording seemed to be a bit like a snake oil salesman, e.g., miraculous, magic learning sound etc. But at that time, I was investigating different dog training techniques and I could easily afford a stamp to find out. But when I received your literature, I immediately grasped that this was important and scientific.
I already had my Golden when I received my DOG MASTER kit and he was perhaps 2 years old at the time. I had tried my best to train him, using the choke chain dog training class once a week. Oh, I should mention that I am currently a software engineer, but I have a master's in zoology and a doctorate in mathematics and biometrics.
Anyway, when I received your DOG MASTER System book I was capable of understanding the magnitude of your accomplishment.
I had such a great and immediate success that I dropped out of the dog training class. For 9 more years my Duke continued to learn more and more and more. He loved to learn and to show off what he had learned. People were so amazed at his behavior that they could not believe it.
He responded to complex commands, within sentences spoken in a normal tone of voice. To those watching, he must have seemed almost human. His eyes were always upon me.
I remember that he would lie on the floor watching me for hours. I could give him subtle hand signals with my finger to make him sit up, lie down, stand, stay etc. As he learned, I begin to make the hand signals less and less obvious. And he learned to respond to whisper commands. Oh, it was so much fun and rewarding.
It has been two years now since Duke passed on and now I have decided to get a Pembroke Welch Corgi. I have been rereading the DOG MASTER System book. My poor little book is falling apart now. But as I reread I begin to realize how much more effective I could have been if I had followed your directions more closely.
How much better it will be for me now, to study and to practice before I get my puppy. When you already have your dog, you are so anxious to try the DOG MASTER, that you don't take the time to grasp the importance of each element of your system.
As I now reread your book, I think to myself, "How was he able to develop this complex system?" But each of your directions is supported by an analysis of dog behavior. These explanations are so important to me. A human mind requires those explanations in order to apply the DOG MASTER System intelligently.
I have purchased a number of top books on clicker training (operant conditioning). This is the current rage in dog training. But these authors freely admit in their books that they no answers for dog behavior problems.
They don't know how to prevent them or cure them. They don't seem to know how to housetrain a dog. Everyday I see dogs walking their owners (dragging them forward and backwards through the park). The owners plead and yell and tackle and treat and give up in frustration.
Their only consolation is that everyone else's dog behaves the same. I feel so sorry for everyone.
I know that there exists a training system that will produce a dream dog, but it isn't advertised or available. The DOG MASTER System is so vastly superior to any other alternative that I experience a feeling of great loss that it isn't readily available.
You know, instead of attending dog training classes before or at least when they get their puppy.
Teach them about dog behavior and show them how to use DOG MASTER; stress how important it is to use it precisely according to the directions.
Tell them that they might as well throw it in the trash if they don't intend to use it properly. I think that it would be so much easier to grasp in a good video production. Then you could watch it over and over. Hey, don't we all need that timing, rhythm and repetition to learn?
(... and so on....)
Sincerely,
Larry M. Male
-------------
A Professor and a Veterinarian compliment Dr. Miller
Correspondence from two professionals in field of canine studies...
Dear Dr. Miller:
Sometime ago you sent me a complimentary copy of your book "The Secret of Canine Communication." This book has been used extensively in the School of Veterinary Medicine both by the faculty and the student body. They have found this a very useful text and have had much benefit from the opportunity to review the fine work which you have done.
I do appreciate your kindness in sending me this book. I will see that it is placed in our Veterinary Medical Library for the full use of the faculty and the student body of the school. I am sure that many of the students will be interested in placing order for copies of this book as they engage in the practice of canine medicine.
Sincerely,
Wm. E. Jennings, Professor
Auburn University
School of Veterinary Medicine
-o-
Dear Dr. Miller:
The following review has been submitted to New York City Veterinarian and should be published in due course, at the discretion of the Executive Editor:
**********
This is the unique training manual based upon subliminal suggestion by means of a special chain that is so constructed that when it is shaken or thrown it takes advantage of certain harmonic attributions of the dog, and training takes place without leash restraint by means of applying fundamental principles of conditioned reflex psychology.
Apparent dramatic results have been obtained with this approach to training, and it seems to render more conventional approaches obsolete.
The reader who seeks a practical and thorough lesson in applied canine psychology can learn a great deal from the careful perusal of this popularly written manual.
**********
So there you are. I trust it may be helpful to you.
Respectfully yours,
A. Barton, D.V.M.
Book Editor
New York City Veterinarian
--------------
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs.behavior From: "TooCool" <larrymale @hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 17 Jul 2004
Subject: Puppy Wizard's Wits End Training Method
http://www.freewebs.com/thesimplyamazingpuppy wizard/777witsendmanual.htm
I have studied canine behavior and dog training for years. I have a huge library that covers every system of training.
The Puppy Wizard's (Jerry Howe's) Wits' End Training Method is by far the most scientific, the most advanced, the kindest, the quickest and the most effective training method yet discovered.
It is not an assortment of training tips and tricks; it is a logically consistent system. Every behavior problem and every obedience skill is treated in the same logically consistent manner.
Please study his manual carefully. Please endeavor to understand the basis of his system and please follow his directions exactly. His manual is a masterpiece. It is dense with theory, with explanation, with detailed descriptions about why behavior problems occur and how their solution should be approached.
One should not pick and choose from among his methods based upon what you personally like or dislike. His is not a bag of tricks but a complete and integrated system for not only training a dog but for raising a loving companion.
When I once said to Jerry that his system creates for you the dog of your dreams, his response was that it produces for your dog the owner of his dreams.
You see, Jerry has discovered that if you are gentle with your dog then he will be gentle with you, if you praise your dog every time he looks at you, then you will become the center of your dogs world, if you use Jerry's sound distraction with praise, then it takes just minutes-sometimes merely seconds-to train your dog to not misbehave (even in your absence) (Just 15 seconds this morning to train my 10 week old puppy to lie quietly and let me clip his nails).
Using Jerry's scientific method (sound distraction / praise / alteration / variation) it takes just minutes to train you dog to respond to your commands.
What a pleasure it was for me to see my 6 week old puppy running as fast has his wobbly little legs would carry him in response to my recall command-and he comes running every time I call no matter where we are or what he is doing.
At ten weeks old now, my puppy never strains upon his leash thanks to Jerry's hot & cold exercises and his Family Pack Leadership exercises.
Jerry has discovered that if you scold your dog, if you scream at him, if you intimidate him, if you hurt him, if you force him then his natural response is to oppose you.
Is Jerry a nut?
It doesn't make any difference to me whether he is or not. It is a logical fallacy to judge a person's ideas based upon their personality. As far as dogs are concerned, Jerry wears his heart upon his sleeve. It touches him deeply when he hears of trainers forcing, intimidating, scolding or hurting dogs.
More than that, he knows that force is not effective and that it will certainly lead to behavior problems; sometime problems so severe that people put their dogs down because of those problems.
I believe that it is natural for humans to want to control their dog by force. Jerry knows this too. We have all been at our wits' end, haven't we?
Dogs have a natural tendency to mimic. In scientific literature it is referred to allelomimetic behavior. Dogs respond in like kind to force; they respond in like kind to praise.
Don't bribe your dog with treats; give him what he wants most-your kind attention. Give him your praise.
You will be astonished at how your dog 's anxiety will dissipate and how their behavior problems will dissipate along with their anxiety.
Treat Jerry Howe's (The Puppy Wizard) Wits' End Training Method as a scientific principle just as you would the law of gravity and you will have astounding success.
Dog behavior is just as scientific as is gravity.
If you follow Jerry's puppy rules you will get a sweet little Magwai; if you don't you will surely get a little gremlin (anyone see The Gremlins?).
--Larry
-----------------
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs.behavior From: "TooCool" <larrymale @hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 19 Jul 2004 Subject: Dog Behavior Problems
What causes dog behavior problems? Well, first of all, a dog doesn't know that his behavior is a problem until you tell him so. But if you address his behavior negatively then your dog will tend to repeat it-that is just the nature of dogs.
Unfortunately for us humans, our natural tendency is to rebel with emotional outburst, intimidation or force when our dog's behavior annoys us. But we must bite our tongue and praise our dog instead.
You do not believe that your dog is out to get your goat? Just begin to carefully analyze his behavior. Take for instance the case of the Mozart hating dog.
Whoever heard of such a thing? How could such a bizarre behavior begin and become established? Who knows for sure, but it could easily happen like this. You are relaxing listening to your favorite Mozart piece and your dog begins to play rowdily-he is trying to attract your attention-but his commotion annoys you.
You get upset and yell at him to shut-up.
Dogs are very sensitive to your emotions-positive emotions calm them-negative emotions upset them. But your negative attention has just given your dog a lesson on how to get your attention.
How many times do think that it will take to make this behavior automatic? Once, maybe twice is sufficient.
Does your dog act up when you are on the phone? Why? Does he rush doors? Why? Does he jump up on you or others? Why? Does he strain upon his leash?
Why?
What can you do to prevent such behaviors and what can you do to cure them once they have begun.
The classical conditioning and operant conditioning schools of thought will advise you to condition your dog to respond with some other, more acceptable, behavior to the stimulus which instigates the misbehavior.
Elaborate schemes are often devised. For instance condition your dog to run to his crate to get a treat when guests arrive to prevent him from jumping upon your guests.
But this school of thought has nothing to say about preventing such behavior problems in the first place. And what if you don't have any treats left? Or what if you are at your neighbor's house with him?
And what if you wished that your dog would just sit quietly when guests arrived instead of each time having to bribe him to come to his crate?
The force training school of thought will advise you to scold, intimidate or by some means punish your dog for what you deem to be misbehavior.
You do not believe that this approach may cause your dog to dislike or possibly hate you? You do not believe that your dog will find other, perhaps more obnoxious, behaviors in order to get even with you?
This school of thought also has nothing to recommend upon how to prevent these behavior problems in the first place.
I recommend that you learn the value of praise and kind emotions toward your dog. Throw away your treats and your hickory sticks and raise a dog who is calm and loving and who never gets into any trouble.
Learn how to use sound distraction combined with praise to quickly condition your dog to avoid behaviors that you dislike; by quickly, I mean in just a few minutes. Learn to teach your dog commands in minutes using sound, praise, alternation and variation while taking advantage of a dog's natural allelomimetic behavior).
Please study The Puppy Wizard's Wits' End Training Method.
--Larry
-----------
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs.behavior From: "TooCool" <larrymale @hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 21 Jul 2004 15:17:01 GMT
Subject: Re: Dog Behavior Problems
"Lynn K." <java...@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:37cd72a9.0407210206.61b65e3f@posting.google.com..
> "TooCool" <larrym...@hotmail.com> wrote in message <news:pmVKc.2487$jJ1.1185@newssvr32.news.prodigy.com>...
> > What causes dog behavior problems? Well, > > first of all, a dog doesn't know that his > > behavior is a problem until you tell him so. > > But if you address his behavior negatively > > then your dog will tend to repeat it-that > > is just the nature of dogs.
> Huh???? Something's very, very wrong with the > relationship if a dog tends to repeat behaviors > he understands are undesired. That is not > "just the nature of dogs". It's the result of > inept human actions.
> Lynn K. Dogs do not understand the concept of right and wrong. But it is their nature to oppose you. If you pull upon them then they will pull back, if you push upon them then they will push back, if they chew upon your shoe and you scold them then they will naturally chew your shoe again.
Shoo your dog out of your kitchen and he will immediately come back in. Try to keep him from charging the door by pushing him away with your foot and he will charge ever so much more deliberately and he will become an expert at avoiding your foot.
Once your dog figures out your intention, he will figure out a way to oppose it. Your job is to never oppose your dog-then he will never oppose you.
For instance, never put tension upon his lead and he will never strain upon his lead. Praise him even if you do not approve of his behavior.
Use sound distraction with praise to eliminate undesirable behaviors as described in the Puppy Wizard's Wits' End Training Method.
It takes no more than four repetitions to extinguish an undesirable behavior. This can take as little as a few seconds. The undesirable behavior will be extinguished for good and your dog will have received nothing but praise.
Since you have given him nothing to oppose, his natural tendency to oppose will never be stimulated.
It is so easy. It works like magic.
When you come to understand the principles of canine behavior, training becomes incredibly easy. If you oppose those principles of canine behavior, then you may well battle with your dog for the rest of his life.
-- Larry
----------------
Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs.behavior From: "TooCool" <larrymale @hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 25 Jul 2004 02:14:10 GMT
Subject: Re: Dog Behavior Problems
Sound distraction, with praise, works for any dog, regardless of breed, age, temperament or past experience. It is not a trick or training tip. It is a scientific principle that applies to canines in general. If it did not work for you, then you did not perform it correctly.
Remember, your sound distraction must be accompanied immediately by praise lasting from 5 to 15 seconds. During this 5 to 15 second period your dog will be thinking.
Observe them closely to see the telltale signs that they are thinking.
The sound distraction must not originate from the trainer twice in a row. The sound distraction must alternately originate from the trainer and then originate from the dog or beyond the dog.
That is why you need something that you can toss that will not make any sound until it lands. You begin praising as soon as it makes its sound.
If the misbehavior continues after four alternating attempts, then call your dog to you and retry the sound distraction with praise a little while later. This prevents any battles with your dog.
Never use your sound distraction as an aversive (to frighten or to intimidate)-that invalidates the scientific principle upon which this method is based. The praise is just as important as is the sound distraction.
The scientific principle upon which the sound distraction with praise method is based is the same as that of Pavlov's conditioned reflex.
However, it has been proven that this sound distraction system will condition a behavior in dogs in less than half the number of attempts as required by Pavlov's method.
Condition your dog to your praise by praising them every time that they look at you.
If you desire a thinking dog, never use treats for training because your dog's mind will focus upon the food rather than upon his lesson.
Please study the Puppy Wizard's Wits' End Training Method to learn the entire theory and application of these principles.
His system is based upon scientific principles and it is logically consistent from start to finish.
Once you appreciate that it is in the nature of a dog to oppose you then you will begin to make rapid progress with your training. You will then devise your training techniques so as to avoid any opposition-physical or mental.
Do not let your dog detect any emotion that will tell him that he is succeeding in opposing you. In other words never let your dog feel that he is opposing you, because if you do, he will certainly frustrate you with continued opposition.
That is why it is so important to always praise your dog. If you reveal to your dog that he is not doing what you want him to do, then he will, by his very nature, continue to oppose you.
If, however, you devise your training methods so that your dog never knows that he is opposing you, then you will make rapid progress.
For example, to teach a dog not to forge ahead of you, simply reverse direction without notice and praise-this is a training method that reveals no opposition from you.
Another example: if your dog strains upon his lead, praise him when his lead is slack. When he hits the end of his lead, pull him back an inch and then praise the slack lead.
Since it doesn't take long for a dog's natural thigmotactic reflex to operate, don't pull back for more than an instant and then immediately praise his slack lead.
--Larry
-------------------
And here's a few NORMAL dog lovers!:
"I'd call the SHOCK fence effective and safe. Humane is one of those hot words that people can debate all day so I won't touch that one. There are people who would call a regular chain link fence inhumane," liea altshuller.
"I know this is a hard subject to bring up without starting the whole cruelty thread again so I'll state my opinion once and won't defend it further: any method can be cruel for some dogs.
Even the slightest punishment was wrong for Cubbe at the beginning, but we've come a long way since then.
She trusts us now as I mentioned in a recent post.
Point is, she's been rewarded for coming, but she's never been punished, even in the mildest way, for not coming.
Is it time for that?
What might I look for to tell?"
"Julia Altshuler" <jaltshu...@comcast.net> wrote in message news:McYnb.45145$ao4.106231@attbi_s51...
After talking with the vet yesterday and watching Cubbe all day today, I'm convinced that the shaking is behavioral, not physical. Naturally I'll continue keeping an eye on her, but when I add everything up, I don't see symptoms of anything neurological-- and the vet agrees. --Lia
"Things are beginning to get much worse day by day and the vets seem unable to help:
http://tinyurl.com/fbqnw
THAT'S AN OCD. His owner CAUSED IT by MISHANDLING and ABUSING his dog according to the BEST advice of HOWER Gang Of Lying Dog Abusing Punk Thug Cowards And ACTIVE LONG TERM INCURABLE MENTAL CASES and ASYLUM ESCAPEES.
> how effective are these electronic fences in > keeping a dog on a property???? Some run through it. Others get shocked and become too scared to go out in the yard anymore.
Just heard of a guy that has to rehome his dog, because the dog got caught right in the path of the shock and will now not go near his person, won't go outside.
Just hides under a desk in the house.
----------------------------------
"micha el" <spam_yurs...@spamyourmamma.com> wrote in message news:yIydnZpPsIzg6l_d4p2dnA@comcast.com...
Anyway, contrary to your PR, this is what it felt like to me when I got shocked by Hope's collar.
It felt like a bomb going off in my hand and forearm.
--------------------------
> He was next to me and I could see his neck > muscles pulsing. He didn't even blink an eye. > Janet Boss
> > > I can't imagine needing anything higher > > > than a 5 with it, even with an insensitive > > > dog like a Lab. An INSENSITIVE DOG???
> > I can't remember what model of Innotek I have, but > > I had a pointer ignore a neck-muscle-pulsing 9. ========
"Loop the lead (it's basically a GIANT nylon or leather choke collar) over his snarly little head, and give him a stern correction" --Janet Boss
On 6 Feb 2006 17:41:08 GMT, Mary Healey <mhhea...@iastate.edu>, clicked their heels and said:
> Does that include tone of voice? Some tools are easier > to ban than others.
yes - screaming banshees are told to shut up! And I always have to remind spouses that they may NOT do the "honey - you're supposed to be doing it like THIS"...... -- Janet B www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com
"Speech is a mirror of the soul: as a man speaks, so is he." Publilius Syrus, First century B.C., Maxim 1073
"We are what we do."
From: Marshall Dermer (der...@alpha1.csd.uwm.edu) Subject: Re: Jerry's Dog Training Manual Date: 2001-07-12 06:49:13 PST
>Paul B wrote: >> While the concept of shake cans is not new, [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >> is unique to Jerry (and Marilyn) and from my own >> experiences is an important part of the process. And how do we know this aspect of his advice is right?
Jerry is not God and his manual is not the Bible.
His advice could be subject to an empirical analysis.
--Marshall
(Also, it is best to killfile posts from the few regulars here who are either ill-tempered, ill- mannered, or just plain ill.),
--Marshall
Subject: Subject changed: JUMPING / MOUTHING On PEOPLE (Ninnyboy)
26 From: Marshall Dermer - Date: Tues, Aug 14 2001 Email: der...@alpha1.csd.uwm.edu (Marshall Dermer) In article <2e501ccd.0108141341.7f18d...@posting.google.com> mattburns...@yahoo.com (Matthew Burnside) writes:
Dear Matt:
Many have offered Jerry constructive advice but Jerry has failed to profit from it.
My sincere advice is to filter out Jerry's posts. --Marshall
PS: I have put "Ninnyboy" in the header for many of us filter posts with this term. The term indicates that the post is about Jerry.
I have read rpdb for about five years.
Consequently, I urge newbies to attend to the civil and rational posts of the rpdb regulars from whom I have learned much.
They include: Ann (,Twzl, Sligo & Roy), Amy Dahl, Diane Blackman, jdoee, Janet Boss, Susan Fraser, Avrama Gingold, Nancy Holmes, Lynn Kosmakos, Bob Maida, MaryBeth, Ruth Mays, Cindy Tittle Moore, Robin Nuttall, Denna Pace, John Richardson, Sarah Sionnach, Ludwig Smith, Jane Webb, and Terri Willis.
*(EVERY WON of them got VERY LONG POSTED CASE HISTORIES Of ACCUTE CHRONIC INCURABLE MENTAL ILLNESS an HURTIN INTIMIDATIN an MURDERIN INNOCENT DEFENSELESS DUMB CRITTERS an LYIN AbHOWET IT.)
Marshall Lev Dermer/Associate Professor/Behavior Analysis Specialty/Department of Psychology/ University of Wisconsin--Milwaukee/Milwaukee, WI 53201 Office Phone: 414-229-6067/ Home Phone: 414-332-8606 der...@uwm.edu http://www.uwm.edu/~dermer
"If I am not for myself, who will be for me. But if I am only for myself, what am I?" _The Talmud_
------------------------------
YOU'RE FRAUDS, drs. p. and dermer!
Either DEFEND your LIES, ABUSE, And Degrees, or get the heel HOWETA THIS BUSINESS.
"Rocky" <2...@rocky-dog.com> wrote in message news:Xns92FEEC097E4AAaustralianshepherdca@130.133.1.4... > > Linda wrote in rec.pets.dogs.behavior: > > When you compare using sound and > > praise to solve a problem with using > > shock collars, hanging, and punishment > > how can you criticize the use of sound?
> There's nothing more to be said, then. > You've made up your mind.
> But you've impressed me by mentioning > that you're a professor with 30 years of > experience.
> So, can you cite some examples of > people recommending "shock collars, > hanging, and punishment"? > -- > --Matt. Rocky's a Dog. > >> I do know that hitting, hurting your dog >> will often make the dog either aggressive >> or a fear biter, neither of which we want >> to do. > > And neither does anyone else, Jerome. > No matter what Jerry Howe states. > > --Matt. Rocky's a Dog. > > BUT, giving you the benefit of the > doubt, please provide a quote (an > original quote, not from one of Jerry > Howe's heavily edited diatribes) that > shows a regular poster promoting or > using an abusive form of training. > --Matt. Rocky's a Dog. > > So, can you cite some examples of > people recommending "shock collars, > hanging, and punishment"? > -- > --Matt. Rocky's a Dog. > > What's the point, but: Refer me to those posts of > which you have read so many. While you're going > through them, point out those which recommend > shocking, and pinching, and beating. Thank you. > -- > -Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
> Rocky wrote: > "Deltones" <vibrov...@hotmail.com> said in > rec.pets.dogs.behavior: > > > After your defense of "Limited" choking, what > > would be the point? Where I come from, choking > > is choking. It's never limited. > > So, you can't point out abuse where none occurs. > Thank you for your contribution. >- > --Matt. Rocky's a Dog. >
From: Rocky (2...@rocky-dog.com) Subject: Re: How to handle aggressive situations Date: 2004-10-19 19:42:54 PST
Melanie L Chang said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> I try really hard not to yell. The times that I have, > Solo joined in and then lunged to the end of the > leash.
Or, at the other end of the spectrum, Rocky cowers, thinking I'm angry at him - a reason I don't "yuk out" others' dogs at agility trials or training. -- --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
---------------
Sometimes my "voice of god" startles human and dog, especially when the human didn't see the inappropriate behaviour. --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
"Rocky" <2...@rocky-dog.com> wrote in message news:Xns92C1EC10BFE7australianshepherdca@130.133.1.4...
Rosa Palmén wrote in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> Anybody else got bilingual dogs?
Long ago my Hebrew was pretty good - but now I only use "Chutza"(throat clearing 'ch') - "Out" when it's reallyreally important that my dogs get away from something.
"Well, Jack Did Hit My Dog. Actually I'd Call It A Sharp Tap Of The Crook To The Nose. I Know Jack Wouldn't Have Done It If He Thought Solo Couldn't Take It. I Still Crate Him Because Otherwise I Fear He Might Eat My Cat," Melanie Lee Chang * mch...@lppi.ucsf.edu Canine Behavioral Genetics Project University of California, San Francisco http://psych.ucsf.edu/K9BehavioralGenetics/
From: Rocky <2...@rocky-dog.com> Date: 10 Jun 2003 18:00:45 GMT Subject: Re: Absolutely abysmal agility day
Robin Nuttall said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> One of the things that frustrates me the most about > agility is that people seem to think that ALL dogs > are fragile, shrinking flowers who cannot be > corrected in any way.
Well, maybe one day -- when Friday doesn't take correction so much to heart -- I'll try something different. Right now, he's just getting the confidence to work a few jumps ahead of me. -- --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
"I crate Rocky, even though he's 8.5 years old, but only when I'm gone during summertime days - maybe an hour at the most.
(Other than hot days, my dogs are always with me.)
While Friday has been totally reliable unsupervised from the day I got him from a rescue, Rocky has not. Rocky will go looking for food even in areas where there's no possibility of food.
The good thing is that he likes his crate, runs for it when I ask, and gets food when he's in it. -- --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
BWEEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHHAAA!!!
From: Rocky (mbon...@sunada.com) Subject: Re: Leg Humper Date: 1999/09/14
Bioso...@aol.com (Jerry Howe) wrote in <37D698CF.405B0...@bellsouth.net>:
> By "sticking your knee up," I can only presume > that you are suggesting that the people knee the > dog in the chest. If that's what you meant, just > say it, instead of beating around the bush to avoid > criticism from people like me. That kind of crap > has got to stop, and that's why I'm here, to help > wean you guys off of the abuse and into the proper > methods of dealing with behavior problems.
Jerry, I was appreciating your explanation up until this last paragraph.
Why did you blow it?
--Matt
From: Rocky <2...@rocky-dog.com> Date: 16 Sep 2003 03:47:41 GMT Subject: Re: Dominant Agressive Puppy????
Nessa said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> the only thing I remember learning from a spanking > was to run faster than my dad and NOT GET > CAUGHT. so what does that say?
I learned to put a comic book down the back of my pants. And sometimes my parents pretended not to notice. In retrospect, that's pretty cool. -- --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
"Rocky" <2...@rocky-dog.com> wrote in message news:Xns92FE730764918australianshepherdca@130.133.1.4...
> Melinda Shore wrote in rec.pets.dogs.behavior: > > > But he's the one producing the training > > MATTerial.
> Ack. You just gave him some moore ammunition. > -- > --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
Oh? You mean LIKE THIS, matty?:
From: Rocky <2...@rocky-dog.com> Date: 15 May 2005 16:03:05 GMT
Subject: Re: What does "bupkis" really mean
shelly said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> you've just described elliott. i don't think Lucy would > have had a clue what to do with him, though. while he's > easy and forgiving in terms of handling, i think his prey > drive and dog aggression would've had her in tears. Hmm. You've got a point. Rocky is dog-dominant, a surprise to almost everyone - some of whom know him very well. I wonder how well Lucy reads dog? If she can't, she'd get some ugly surprises.
-- --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
BWEEEEEEEEEEEEEAHAHAHAHHAHHAAAA!!!
> -- > --Matt. Rocky's a Dog. BWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAHAHAHAHHHAHAAA!!!
From: Rocky <2...@rocky-dog.com> Date: 24 Mar 2005 17:16:47 Subject: Re: help with identifing a dog breed
A mature dog comfortable in its surroundings often won't need to physically assert its dominance. -- --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
From: Rocky <2...@rocky-dog.com> Date: 22 Dec 2004 16:58:38 GMT A Useful Dog
... Rocky, OTOH, I crate when a new dog is introduced - while he's quick to back off in times of trouble, he's fairly dominant. -- --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
BWEEEEEEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHHAHHAHAAAA!!!
"dallygirl" <kwickwick@hotmail.com> said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior:
> choke chains are outdated and barbaric in many > cases causing more harm than good.
Back at you with flat buckle collars. These are an incredibly abused training tool, what with the number of handlers I see pulling back and jerking on the leash with both hands.
It's a good thing that most of us are here because of dogs' well-being and not an agenda. -- --Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
BWEEEEAHAHAHHAAA!!!
> He was next to me and I could see his neck > muscles pulsing. He didn't even blink an eye. > Janet Boss
> > > I can't imagine needing anything higher > > > than a 5 with it, even with an insensitive > > > dog like a Lab. An INSENSITIVE DOG???
> > I can't remember what model of Innotek I have, but > > I had a pointer ignore a neck-muscle-pulsing 9. ========
"Loop the lead (it's basically a GIANT nylon or leather choke collar) over his snarly little head, and give him a stern correction" --Janet Boss
On 6 Feb 2006 17:41:08 GMT, Mary Healey <mhhea...@iastate.edu>, clicked their heels and said:
> Does that include tone of voice? Some tools are easier > to ban than others.
yes - screaming banshees are told to shut up! And I always have to remind spouses that they may NOT do the "honey - you're supposed to be doing it like THIS"...... -- Janet B www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com
"Reliable Punishment Cycles, Different Thresholds To Pain And Punishment, High Tolerance For Correction, Escalation Of Correction To A Level Where The Dog Yelps When You Punish Him, Thus Making The Experience One Which The Dog Will Want To Avoid In The Future," grant teeboon, RAAF.
"Well, Jack Did Hit My Dog. Actually I'd Call It A Sharp Tap Of The Crook To The Nose. I Know Jack Wouldn't Have Done It If He Thought Solo Couldn't Take It. I Still Crate Him Because Otherwise I Fear He Might Eat My Cat,"Melanie Lee Chang * mchang@lppi.ucsf.edu Canine Behavioral Genetics Project University of California, San Francisco http://psych.ucsf.edu/K9BehavioralGenetics/
captain arthur haggerty SEZ: "A CHIN CHUCK" Makes A ResoundingSound Distraction: "When You Chuck The Dog The Sound Will Travel Up The Mandible To The Ears And Give A Popping Sound To The Dog."
"Many People Have Problems Getting The Pinch Right, Either They Do Not Pinch Enough, Or They Have A Very Stoic Dog. Some Dogs Will Collapse Into A Heap. About The Ear Pinch: You Must Keep The Pressure Up," sindy "don't let the dog SCREAM" mooreon, author of HOWER FAQ's pages on k9 web.
"After Numerous Training Classes, Behavioral Consultations, And Hundreds Of Dollars In Vet Bills, I Killed My Dalmatian Several Years Ago Due To Extreme Dog-Aggressiveness," mustang sally.
"I'll bet you don't know a thing about me. I volunteered as assistant to the euthanasia tech at our local shelter for a while, and I know a bit about overpopulation and unwanted animals.
This however has nothing at all to do with responsible breeders, because responsible breeders don't contribute to that problem," Mustang Sally.
Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2001 Subject: Re: shock collars
Sally Hennessey <greyho...@ncweb.com> wrote in message news:b8m1dtsv6vuiblo63h8ekqiforibadrff2@4ax.com...
Aside from being incredibly offensive and self- righteous, this post shows and absence of knowledge in the differences in dogs' temperaments, or perhaps a lack of ability to perceive same.
The fact that you, Alison, have never met a dog to whom corrections and discomfort, even pain, were unimportant does not mean that such dogs do not exist.
What it means is that you don't know as much about dogs as you think you do, and you surely don't know a damn thing about Harlan or anyone else's dog here.
I had a Dalmatian that would instigate fights with one of her housemates; that dog had no fear or anything, and pain incurred during a fight meant nothing to her.
I know that that dog is not unique, and I'm sure many people here can tell similar stories. The fact that you, Alison, continue to say things to people such as what you said to Theresa about causing her dog to suffer (at least I guess that's what you meant by "you cause your dog suffers" - - must be the King's English you guys talk about over there) means that you are an ignorant, arrogant, insensitive person who is not worth further notice.
Sally Hennessey
Nope. No more than you'd convince Patch that prongs and e-collars, in the right hands, are not intrinsically abusive; or that dogs trained properly with prongs or e-collars are not fearful, in pain, or intimidated; or that any one of us here knows our own dogs and their reactions better than someone who has never seen them or us...hmmm.
I'm starting to see some similarities here.
Sally Hennessey
3 From: sighthounds & siberians Date: Mon, Jun 12 2006 4:16 pm
montana wildhack wrote:
> On 2006-06-10 16:56:28 -0400, sighthounds & siberians <x...@ncweb.com> said:
> > Plus > > she's easier to clean up when she
> I'm sorry to read that.
> Aside from the shedding, I hardly know how to act > since we have one almost 5 year old dog with no > major health issues. It's really weird. I dream of such weirdness. Matty's death reduced the number of males requiring belly bands for medical reasons, as well as the number of dogs taking Previcox.
But Anna's feeding routines and medications are really expensive and time-consuming. On a good note, she stopped eating canned food during the last bout of aspiration pneumonia (#5, I think) and we switched her to kibble (soaked until soggy, then ground up with a mixer until it's sort of a paste, and formed into balls).
*Much* cheaper, less messy when she inevitably coughs it all over the vicinity and the person feeding, higher in calories, and she really likes it, at least for now. I can't imagine what it would be like to never chew anything crunchy again, poor dog.
Mustang Sally
"Janet Boss offered a pat on the back, commenting t hat ultimately it wasn't Kate's decision. Whose was it? I asked. Why, it was Teena's, averred Janet.
Janet was in an exculpatory frame of mind because she contributed to this travesty herself, by advising Kate to repeat the aggression trigger (grooming) on a daily basis.
It's all in the archives.
Now these two are spouting off about what kind of e-collars they like to use on their dogs. Well, I've got an AC Delco model that would be just right for Janet or Kate. BZZZZzzt! I'd have to find it though, and I can't remember if I left it in my underground bunker or the crawlspace under my house," Charlie.
Here's janet's PARTNER:
"The actual quote is misleading when taken out of context"
sinofabitch writes:
> > What I have said- repeatedly - is that he > > took posts from two different people, > > took pieces of them out of context, Of curse. QUOTED. You wanna see it in context?
> > cobbled them together, No. There was WON DIRECT QUOTE.
> > then added his own words: "Neatly," and "Smartly."
> > and a fake signature. "sinofabitch" instead of sionnach.
> > Which is exactly what he did. INDEEDY. That's HOWE COME you deny it.
> > The actual quote is misleading That so?
> > when taken out of context, We'd been talkin abHOWET beatin the dog with a shoe...
> > and Jerry's faked "quote" The WON sinofabitch totally DENIES.
> > is downright meaningless. Only if you're a MENTAL CASE.
Here's Jerry's version
"I Dropped The Leash, Threw My Right Arm Over The Lab's Shoulder, Grabbed Her Opposite Foot With My Left Hand, Rolled Her On Her Side, Leaned On Her, Smartly Growled Into Her Throat And Said "GRRRR!" And Neatly Nipped Her Ear," sinofabitch.
Here's yours:
"I dropped the leash, threw my right arm over the Lab's shoulder, grabbed her opposite foot with my left hand, rolled her on her side, leaned on her, said "GRRRR!" and nipped her ear. --Sara Sionnach
"The actual quote is misleading when taken out of context"
See?
"Warning: Sometimes The Corrections Will Seem Quite Harsh And Cause You To Cringe. This Is A Normal Reaction The First Few Times It Happens, But You'll Get Over It." mike duforth, author: "CourteHOWES Canine."
"I have heard advice stating that you should pre-load your dog for Bitter Apple for it to work as efficiently as possible. What does this mean?
When you bring home the Bitter Apple for the first time, spray one squirt directly into the dog's mouth and walk away. The dog won't be too thrilled with this but just ignore him and continue your normal behavior." --Mike Dufort author of the zero selling book "CourteHOWES Canines"
Borrowed from: "Puppy Raising Tips" from professional trainers, John and Amy Dahl.
"Around four months many puppies can withstand a correction. Unfortunately this is the time they start teething and if their mouth hurts, they may act generally sensitive. If this is the case, be patient and wait for all those baby teeth to fall out.
In training, retrievers often respond to physical correction better than verbal correction. While "NO!" is extremely useful if puppy is about to bite an electrical cord or steal food off the table, when you are teaching them something (like obedience) a sharp jerk on their lead or swat with a stick gets the message across with less emotion and less effect on their confidence.
If they drop the dummy and act like their mouth hurts when they are teething, stop all retrieving and wait for their mouth to feel better. A correction should be just severe enough to get the dog to respond.
Repeated weak corrections are very stressful to the dog."
================
"I Would Never Advise Anyone To Slap A Dog I Do Not Believe There Is A Single Circumstance Ever, Where Slapping A Dog Is Anything But Destructive," "I don't see why anyone would want to choke or beat a dog, or how any trainer could possibly get a good working dog by making them unhapper, fearful, cowering, etc." sez amy lying frosty dahl.
lying frosty dahl sez she doesn't twist: "None of my posts, prior to or subsequent to Jerry Howe's attacks, encourage anyone to twist ears, beat dogs, confront, intimidate, frighten, or any of the crap he constantly attributes to me," lying frosty dahl.
lying frosty dahl, oakhill kennels wrote: Get A 30"- 40" Stick.You can have a helper wield the stick, or do it yourself. Tougher, less tractable dogs may require you to progress to striking them more sharply
Try pinching the ear between the metal casing and the collar, even the buckle on the collar. Persist! Eventually, the dog will give in
but will squeal, thrash around, and direct their efforts to escaping the ear pinch
You can press the dog's ear with a shotshell instead of your thumb even get a studded collar and pinch the ear against that
Make the dog's need to stop the pinching so urgent that resisting your will fades in importance.
CHUCK IT Under ITS Chin With That Ever Ready Right Hand, As it catches on, try using the stick and no ear pinch.
When the dog is digging out to beat the stick and seems totally reliable without any ear pinch, you are finished
If the dog drops it, chuck it solidly under the chin, say "No! Hold!"
(stay on the ear until it does) (perhaps because the ear is getting tender, or the dog has decided it isn't worth it)" lying frosty dahl.
"Chin cuff absolutely does not mean slap," professora gingold.
terri willis, Psychoclown wrote: "Nope. That "beating dogs with sticks" things is something you twisted out of context, because you are full of bizarro manure."
"Pudge Was So Soft That She Could And Would Avoid A Simple Swat On The Rump With A Riding Crop," lying frosty dahl, discoverer of CANNIBALISM in Labradors.
"Granted That The Dog Who Fears Retribution Will Adore His Owner," lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn.
lyinglynn writes to a new foster care giver: For barking in the crate - leave the leash on and pass it through the crate door. Attach a line to it. When he barks, use the line for a correction.- if necessary, go to a citronella bark collar," Lynn K.
"Training is not confrontation,"Lynn K.
<except when it is>
"Unfortunately, some confrontation is necessary, just to be able to handle the dogs. For example, we need to crate train a dog immediately because they are usually in need of medical care and they are in foster homes with other dogs. It's a safety necessity," lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn.
"Training is not confrontation,"Lynn K.
<except when it is>
"So what? Whoever said that it's right to always not confront? We sure can try, but a dog who knows a command and growls when given it is certainly being confrontational". You can't simply walk away and pretend it didn't happen or leave it for later work in every situation." Lynn K.
--------------------
"I used to work the Kill Room as a volunteer in one shelter.) But their ability to set their own schedules and duties causes a great deal of scheduling overhead.
And it takes effort and thought to ensure that volunteers get the meaningful experience that they work for.
Someone has to be responsible for that Volunteer Program, and it is best done by a non-volunteer."
Lynn K.
----------------
"I worked with one shelter where I bathed and groomed every adoptable dog on intake. I frankly felt that the effort/benefit equation was not balanced for some of the older/ill poodle/terrier mixes we got in badly matted condition.
Should I have refused to groom them?
Or even more pertinent - I was one of the people who had to make the euthanasia decisions at that shelter."
Lynn K.
----------------
I'll be you've never had to put down litters of beautiful labrador puppies? If you had did, maybe you'd be singing a different tune?
"Actually, have held them for the tech to euth, and put their bodies in the trash bag and in the freezer for the trash company to come and dispose of.
No different tune," ~Emily ~emily is a vivisectionist for a med research laboratory.
HOWEDY janet,
Looks like you and your pals have gone totally INSANE again:
Janet B wrote:
> On Fri, 02 Dec 2005 14:44:14 -0500, Janet B > <j...@bestfriendsdogobedience.com>, clicked their heels and said: > > Since you quoted me repeatedly, where does it say I beat dogs, choke > > dogs, scream at dogs, etc? Thanks for your clarification. .
> responding to my own post, I had to go back and look at the original > post, to remind myself what "we" are all accused of doing: [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > Beat the living crap out of? hardly - no hitting exists "Chin CHUCK absolutely doesn't mean slap," professora gingold.
"BethF" <b...@NOT-SO-bad-dawgs-in-ak.com> wrote in message news:v4r8kkfr257e1a@corp.supernews.com...
Kyle, FWIW, i thought it was pretty funny, and i often call my little dog the turd, because he is one. Some folks think its HORRRIBLE i would insult my dog like that so i guess its just a matter of personality.
Kyle, the best way to teach him to stay away is to step on him once. Seriously.
"Whatever Motivates The Dog, But I Daresay Most Of The Dogs I Have In Classes Just Aren't That Interested In Praise."
Maybe that's what we should do - hold back the dobie girl so that Izzy can put Simon in his place.
"I'd call the SHOCK fence effective and safe. Humane is one of those hot words that people can debate all day so I won't touch that one. There are people who would call a regular chain link fence inhumane," liea altshuller.
"I know this is a hard subject to bring up without starting the whole cruelty thread again so I'll state my opinion once and won't defend it further: any method can be cruel for some dogs.
Even the slightest punishment was wrong for Cubbe at the beginning, but we've come a long way since then.
She trusts us now as I mentioned in a recent post.
Point is, she's been rewarded for coming, but she's never been punished, even in the mildest way, for not coming.
Is it time for that?
What might I look for to tell?"
"Julia Altshuler" <jaltshu...@comcast.net> wrote in message news:McYnb.45145$ao4.106231@attbi_s51...
After talking with the vet yesterday and watching Cubbe all day today, I'm convinced that the shaking is behavioral, not physical. Naturally I'll continue keeping an eye on her, but when I add everything up, I don't see symptoms of anything neurological-- and the vet agrees. --Lia
"Things are beginning to get much worse day by day and the vets seem unable to help:
http://tinyurl.com/fbqnw
THAT'S AN OCD. His owner CAUSED IT by MISHANDLING and ABUSING his dog according to the BEST advice of HOWER Gang Of Lying Dog Abusing Punk Thug Cowards And ACTIVE LONG TERM INCURABLE MENTAL CASES and ASYLUM ESCAPEES.
> how effective are these electronic fences in > keeping a dog on a property???? Some run through it. Others get shocked and become too scared to go out in the yard anymore.
Just heard of a guy that has to rehome his dog, because the dog got caught right in the path of the shock and will now not go near his person, won't go outside.
Just hides under a desk in the house.
----------------------------------
"micha el" <spam_yurs...@spamyourmamma.com> wrote in message news:yIydnZpPsIzg6l_d4p2dnA@comcast.com...
Anyway, contrary to your PR, this is what it felt like to me when I got shocked by Hope's collar.
It felt like a bomb going off in my hand and forearm.
--------------------------
"Warning: Sometimes The Corrections Will Seem Quite Harsh And Cause You To Cringe. This Is A Normal Reaction The First Few Times It Happens, But You'll Get Over It." mike duforth, author: "CourteHOWES Canine."
"I have heard advice stating that you should pre-load your dog for Bitter Apple for it to work as efficiently as possible. What does this mean?
When you bring home the Bitter Apple for the first time, spray one squirt directly into the dog's mouth and walk away. The dog won't be too thrilled with this but just ignore him and continue your normal behavior." --Mike Dufort author of the zero selling book "CourteHOWES Canines"
Amy Dahl writes:
"From where I sit, there is a difference. I haven't noticed any of the contingent who like Koehler trying to force their method on everyone, or calling others names because they do not use the method.
I personally believe the Koehler method is a more humane way of teaching than any alternative I have studied.
And I am not averse to learning--I have studied a number of methods.
Koehler, of course, stops far short of the specialized work I do with retrievers, and some of the things in his book, such as making the dog walk behind the handler on the "finish," are inappropriate for retriever work.
Why do I think Koehler's method is more humane than others?
First, I don't believe "corrections vs. no corrections" is as significant to dogs as it is to people. Applied correctly, Koehler's method uses *no* intimidation, fear, or emotional manipulation. It is clear and definite, and the handler's actions are always predictable. The method is masterfully designed to prevent confrontation or vying for control in any way. It places high demands of responsibility on the trainer, and takes a great deal of commitment to do correctly, so it is not for the casual "dabbler." When done well,very few corrections are needed.
In brief, I think the clarity, predictability, and absence of emotional blackmail weigh more strongly in the method's favor, than the occasional brief unpleasantness of correction weighs against it." lying frosty dahl.
----------------------------
YOU MEAN LIKE THIS?:
> diddy wrote:
>> [] >> >>They just aren't my thing. I DO like working with soft dogs. And I >> >>guess I've never met a soft Lab. They remind me of lumber wagons.
>> > Well, there are many such Labs, but they probably weren't field-bred.
> IME there are lots of soft Labs, and some of the recent > field-bred dogs are among the worst. In the 60's, when > you worked with them, if I understand correctly, they > were probably more consistently tough and resilient. That's > the traditional nature of the breed.
> Trainer Mike Lardy thinks we are getting the softer, more > sensitive dogs today because training methods using modern > e-collars are so much better and more gentle than they used > to be, it doesn't take a tough dog to come through training > in good shape. I think it's a plausible argument.
> Doesn't fit the stereotype the ignorant have of e-collars.
> We still get a few that are happy and eager no > matter what we do to them.
> Amy Dahl ----------------------
Of curse, those methods sometimes end in disaster:
"Nelson is definately the real deal," lynn k:
From: Lynn Kosmakos Date: Fri, Nov 3 2000 1:41 am Email: Lynn Kosmakos <lkosma...@home.com>
Lori wrote:
> There is no TEMPERMENT too good to ruin OR too bad to save. > The dog's heart & soul become reflex reaction to it's treatment. Lori, I sincerely wish that were true. (the too bad to save part)
There is innate temperament that is not shaped by treatment.
The dogs our rescue gets from horrible abuse cases quickly proves that.
OTOH, I also see dogs that have never had a single triggering incident who cannot be saved. I've got such a client right now, a 9 month old GSD who we've been fighting to save for months.
He's been seen by Jean Donaldson and Leslie Nelson and a slew of others, and has received nothing by loving care all his life.
His littermates are normal, his breeding excellent, and there was no triggering event or medical cause. As much as it breaks my heart, the dog cannot be saved.
Lynn K.
"Rocky" <2...@rocky-dog.com> wrote in message news:Xns92FEEC097E4AAaustralianshepherdca@130.133.1.4... > > Linda wrote in rec.pets.dogs.behavior: > > When you compare using sound and > > praise to solve a problem with using > > shock collars, hanging, and punishment > > how can you criticize the use of sound?
> There's nothing more to be said, then. > You've made up your mind.
> But you've impressed me by mentioning > that you're a professor with 30 years of > experience.
> So, can you cite some examples of > people recommending "shock collars, > hanging, and punishment"? > -- > --Matt. Rocky's a Dog. > >> I do know that hitting, hurting your dog >> will often make the dog either aggressive >> or a fear biter, neither of which we want >> to do. > > And neither does anyone else, Jerome. > No matter what Jerry Howe states.
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